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Thread: pieces that fit together and the plan moving forward.

  1. #21
    Raptors Republic Starter mike, prague's Avatar
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    Any plan centered on the pursuit of a particular player as the pick, 2 drafts away, is foolhardy in so many ways, it's not funny. I'll mention a few:

    1. In the world of sport, serious injuries happen all the time (see Oden, Roy, now Love for recent examples), so there's no way one even knows if the kid will be even useful 1.5 years from now.
    2. What do you do with the guys you propose to keep on the team? Tell them they have to tank next year? Tank better than anybody else, to "hope" to get a 24% lottery chance, which rarely plays out, at a player that may not even be available? Seriously, what kind of impression do you think JV and Ross would have of the organization if they're told to give an entire year of their career (which could be shorter than planned) to have a lottery's chance in hell to snag a particular player? They'd want out of town so fast.......
    3. Since 2014 is supposed to be a very deep draft, which teams that are likely to have a high draft pick do you think you can entice to giving it up without including either JV or Ross in the deal? My money is on NONE.
    4. What kind of support do you think you're going to get from the fanbase that pay for tickets, when you blow up a re-build half way through it, and tank like crazy to hope you win the lottery that seldom goes to the worst team (it's called a lottery for good reason). Want to follow the Seattle model and tank enough to lose the team to another city after MAYBE (odds are against) getting that franchise player?
    Exactly what I was about to write. It is sooo stupid to build your future on if and whens and especially on what you expect people will want and that all the percentages will go your way. All the Wiggins talk is just crazy. I'd love him in a Raptors uniform, but expecting that it'll happen in the future is making a fool of yourself.

  2. #22
    Raptors Republic All-Star DoNDaDDa's Avatar
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    Quote mike, prague wrote: View Post
    What when???
    couple years back jose & reggie evans were traded to Charlotte for Tyson Chandler & boris diaw...then MJ nixed the deal & made is GM look the fool..Tyson Chandler was traded to dallas days latter for a bag of pretzels LOL

  3. #23
    Raptors Republic All-Star ezz_bee's Avatar
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    Any plan centered on the pursuit of a particular player as the pick, 2 drafts away, is foolhardy in so many ways, it's not funny. I'll mention a few:

    1. In the world of sport, serious injuries happen all the time (see Oden, Roy, now Love for recent examples), so there's no way one even knows if the kid will be even useful 1.5 years from now.
    2. What do you do with the guys you propose to keep on the team? Tell them they have to tank next year? Tank better than anybody else, to "hope" to get a 24% lottery chance, which rarely plays out, at a player that may not even be available? Seriously, what kind of impression do you think JV and Ross would have of the organization if they're told to give an entire year of their career (which could be shorter than planned) to have a lottery's chance in hell to snag a particular player? They'd want out of town so fast.......
    3. Since 2014 is supposed to be a very deep draft, which teams that are likely to have a high draft pick do you think you can entice to giving it up without including either JV or Ross in the deal? My money is on NONE.
    4. What kind of support do you think you're going to get from the fanbase that pay for tickets, when you blow up a re-build half way through it, and tank like crazy to hope you win the lottery that seldom goes to the worst team (it's called a lottery for good reason). Want to follow the Seattle model and tank enough to lose the team to another city after MAYBE (odds are against) getting that franchise player?
    +1

    I can't think of a WORSE strategy for an NBA team than centering your plans around the acquisition of 1 particular player.


    The only thing I would add is that trading for draft picks in the hopes of landing the top pick is also misguided because almost all picks that are traded are top 3 protected.

    Would it be great to land Wiggins, absolutely, but it is a completely ridiculous idea to plan your strategy around being able to draft him.
    "We only have one rule on this team. What is that rule? E.L.E. That's right's, E.L.E, and what does E.L.E. stand for? EVERYBODY LOVE EVERYBODY. Right there up on the wall, because this isn't just a basketball team, this is a lifestyle. ~ Jackie Moon

  4. #24
    Raptors Republic Starter imaginelino's Avatar
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    you win the award for most asinine post in this thread. congratulations.
    and you win the award for the most asinine reply to a legitimate post.. congratulations.. here is your slice of pizza

  5. #25
    Raptors Republic All-Star DoNDaDDa's Avatar
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    you win the award for most asinine post in this thread. congratulations.
    if u think my post is asinine then so be it..the fact of the matter is this is a re build & were going in the right direction..i ve got no issues moving players but to blow it up again would be counter productive in soo many ways...

  6. #26
    Raptors Republic Starter imaginelino's Avatar
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    my interest is waning because BC comes of with these half baked plans/doesn't have a plan at all. Im all for patient if a clear plan was in store.

    why dont you lay out these half baked plans for us.. clearly we are rebuilding and he added some pieces in the summer. he has stood pat since and letting the coach do his job.. so what are you talking about..? Seriously, for all the criticism and lack of playoffs I understand but no plan at all after everyone screamed for a rebuild, we sunk last season and here we are.. you wanted to be contenders after one year?

  7. #27
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    Any plan centered on the pursuit of a particular player as the pick, 2 drafts away, is foolhardy in so many ways, it's not funny. I'll mention a few:

    1. In the world of sport, serious injuries happen all the time (see Oden, Roy, now Love for recent examples), so there's no way one even knows if the kid will be even useful 1.5 years from now.
    2. What do you do with the guys you propose to keep on the team? Tell them they have to tank next year? Tank better than anybody else, to "hope" to get a 24% lottery chance, which rarely plays out, at a player that may not even be available? Seriously, what kind of impression do you think JV and Ross would have of the organization if they're told to give an entire year of their career (which could be shorter than planned) to have a lottery's chance in hell to snag a particular player? They'd want out of town so fast.......
    3. Since 2014 is supposed to be a very deep draft, which teams that are likely to have a high draft pick do you think you can entice to giving it up without including either JV or Ross in the deal? My money is on NONE.
    4. What kind of support do you think you're going to get from the fanbase that pay for tickets, when you blow up a re-build half way through it, and tank like crazy to hope you win the lottery that seldom goes to the worst team (it's called a lottery for good reason). Want to follow the Seattle model and tank enough to lose the team to another city after MAYBE (odds are against) getting that franchise player?
    1. injuries are not something I can control, therefore I do not worry about them. Since this is a superstar, in my opinion and several others (dick vitale for one) I am willing to take the chance.

    2. I am not implying we tank at all. I don't think jose calderon,terrence ross,landry fields,ed davis, valanciunas is a lottery team, along with veteran help, like I mentioned above I think they are a fringe playoff team. So the players won't be put in that situation.

    3. the players I mentioned that need to be traded, don't have to be turned in to draft picks right away, they can be turned into other assets (money, other players)which will by 2014 be turned into draft picks.

    4. the fan base is full of fairweather fans anyways, there won't be much of an outcry b/c we won't be tanking like you think we are, we are going to be perennially contending for 8-9 spot.

    this is also a response to everyone that "+1'd" your post.
    Last edited by akashsingh; Tue Jan 22nd, 2013 at 03:06 PM.

  8. #28
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    Quote imaginelino wrote: View Post
    why dont you lay out these half baked plans for us.. clearly we are rebuilding and he added some pieces in the summer. he has stood pat since and letting the coach do his job.. so what are you talking about..? Seriously, for all the criticism and lack of playoffs I understand but no plan at all after everyone screamed for a rebuild, we sunk last season and here we are.. you wanted to be contenders after one year?
    are you retarded? you don't think going after steve nash this summer is half baked?

  9. #29
    Raptors Republic Starter pesterm1's Avatar
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    This akansingh guy has been good laughs some time now.

    @ u not with u.

  10. #30
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    Any plan centered on the pursuit of a particular player as the pick, 2 drafts away, is foolhardy in so many ways, it's not funny.
    I disagree on the funny part.

  11. #31
    Raptors Republic Starter imaginelino's Avatar
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    are you retarded? you don't think going after steve nash this summer is half baked?
    so your basing this on a move that didn't happen. that is retarded.

  12. #32
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    1. injuries are not something I can control, therefore I do not worry about them. Since this is a superstar, in my opinion and several others (dick vitale for one) I am willing to take the chance.

    2. I am not implying we tank at all. I don't think jose calderon,terrence ross,landry fields,ed davis, valanciunas is a lottery team, along with veteran help, like I mentioned above I think they are a fringe playoff team. So the players won't be put in that situation.

    3. the players I mentioned that need to be traded, don't have to be turned in to draft picks right away, they can be turned into other assets (money, other players)which will by 2014 be turned into draft picks.

    4. the fan base is full of fairweather fans anyways, there won't be much of an outcry b/c we won't be tanking like you think we are, we are going to be perennially contending for 8-9 spot.

    oh and fuck you
    You need remedial classes for "special" people like yourself,,,,,,, and to get laid.
    Last edited by p00ka; Tue Jan 22nd, 2013 at 03:19 PM.

  13. #33
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    Quote imaginelino wrote: View Post
    so your basing this on a move that didn't happen. that is retarded.
    that was one example, and it didn't happen b/c steve nash decided not to, not because bc realized it was a stupid plan. signing landry fields, signing turkoglu when we already had a ball dominant player in calderon, are other examples.

  14. #34
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    Quote Hugmenot wrote: View Post
    I disagree on the funny part.
    lol, good point

  15. #35
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    Quote p00ka wrote: View Post
    You need remedial classes for "special" people like yourself,,,,,,, and to get laid.
    I regret the time I wasted forming a rebuttal, you useless piece of trash.

  16. #36
    Raptors Republic All-Star DoNDaDDa's Avatar
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    are you retarded? you don't think going after steve nash this summer is half baked?
    nash was only supposed to help the re build along.. nothing more..it prob. was a bad move though because it did give fans such as yourself a belief that were contenders when infact we arnt.. were STILL re building & that was the plan all along
    Last edited by DoNDaDDa; Tue Jan 22nd, 2013 at 03:24 PM.

  17. #37
    Raptors Republic All-Star ebrian's Avatar
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    I think what bothers me often on this board is people seeing a tiny bit of success and becoming too attached to players. This team needs to consider each and every player as something it can move to become better.

    Imagine you have this sand castle, and you realize that you built it too close to shore and the tide is coming. At first, you thought maybe if you reinforce it a bit it'll stay up. You added a bit of dried grass or popsicle sticks to reinforce the walls, hoping it'll be enough to hold it all together. But it's falling, and each time the tide comes in it is shrinking and falling apart. You end up tearing it down to try a new design, while moving it back a bit so it won't get hit. That is, to me, the definition of 'blowing it up'.

    The Raptors roster including JV, Ross and other promising young players, in reality, is just a bucket of sand right now. The reality is that there's nothing to blow up, we're still in the process of deciding where to put the castle, what the castle should look like, and whether or not we can get better sand.
    your pal,
    ebrian

  18. #38
    Raptors Republic Starter imaginelino's Avatar
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    Quote akashsingh wrote: View Post
    that was one example, and it didn't happen b/c steve nash decided not to, not because bc realized it was a stupid plan. signing landry fields, signing turkoglu when we already had a ball dominant player in calderon, are other examples.
    Signing a former two time MVP champion to a team full of youth that is rebuilding and finding some sort of identity is a direction they could have gone. Oh and he is a national hero. But again, he is not here so we can't judge a team's performance based on who we didn't get. The Turk was a mistake that was quickly corrected, corrected at a time where he had huge money still owing on like 3-4 + years left... no one thought he could get rid of him. He did. I think that's a positive. Landry Fields, yeah big money but hardly the cause of the team's failure this year. Anything else?

  19. #39
    Raptors Republic All-Star Craiger's Avatar
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    Quote DoNDaDDa wrote: View Post
    nash was only supposed to help the re build along.. nothing more..it prob. was a bad move though because it did give fans such as yourself a belief that were contenders when infact we arnt.. were STILL re building
    Chasing Nash was the proof the rebuild wasn't happening.

  20. #40
    Raptors Republic All-Star DoNDaDDa's Avatar
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    Quote Craiger wrote: View Post
    Chasing Nash was the proof the rebuild wasn't happening.
    i guess u fall under the catagory i mentioned above.. we were always in a re build & nash was only supposed to help our young guys take that next step..helping the rebuild NOT ending the rebuild...

    just for the record..i think nash could have helped the young guys quite a bit but im glad he went to LA..
    Last edited by DoNDaDDa; Tue Jan 22nd, 2013 at 03:36 PM.

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