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Terrence Ross VS DeMar DeRozan

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  • #16
    There are so many variables ... but I'd go with minutes as the big comparison.

    Eventhough starting seems like more was given to Demar, when is a rookie more likely to get some looks or a role - with the A unit, or a bench mob?

    What is of real interest is how TRoss already has signs of so many pieces to his game. He is:

    -Arguably the Raptors best 3pt threat (only better % from PG's who may not shoot as often)
    -Able to create his own shot off the dribble. Not much in the lane, but his jumper gets lots of space for what he needs!
    -Gets in the lane for steals, without cheating and giving up blow-bys. Many of his highlights are fast breaks where he created it.

    Demar is a good NBA player, and I think his contract is not too far off his value. I do think TRoss is the preferred option of the future if he starts to add some consistency to his game. SG's need to be able to space the floor with shooting.
    The only way to bag a classy lady is to give her two tickets to the gun show... and see if she likes the goods.

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    • #17
      Nilanka wrote: View Post
      Let's not forget that DeRozan had a double team magnet (i.e Bosh) to help his offense as a rookie. Ross doesn't have that luxury.
      DD is drawing doubles now
      but casey doesnt run any plays to take advantage of a dd-ross dynamic, ross always sitting on the perimeter
      someone call me when we get to see a derozan dish to ross dunk

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      • #18
        phez wrote: View Post
        DD is drawing doubles now
        but casey doesnt run any plays to take advantage of a dd-ross dynamic, ross always sitting on the perimeter
        someone call me when we get to see a derozan dish to ross dunk
        The DeRozan dish to Ross for the 3 is the play I am more interested in seeing.

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        • #19
          Papa Burgundy wrote: View Post
          There are so many variables ... but I'd go with minutes as the big comparison.

          Eventhough starting seems like more was given to Demar, when is a rookie more likely to get some looks or a role - with the A unit, or a bench mob?

          What is of real interest is how TRoss already has signs of so many pieces to his game. He is:

          -Arguably the Raptors best 3pt threat (only better % from PG's who may not shoot as often)
          -Able to create his own shot off the dribble. Not much in the lane, but his jumper gets lots of space for what he needs!
          -Gets in the lane for steals, without cheating and giving up blow-bys. Many of his highlights are fast breaks where he created it.

          Demar is a good NBA player, and I think his contract is not too far off his value. I do think TRoss is the preferred option of the future if he starts to add some consistency to his game. SG's need to be able to space the floor with shooting.
          100% agree. Which is even more reason why I just fail to understand the logic behind BC's moves.

          A) If you're going to re-sign DeRozan for big money immediately, why draft Ross @ #8?

          B) If you believe strongly enough in Ross to draft him @ #8, confident that he excells in areas where DeRozan has proven to be consistently weak (ie: 3pt shooting), why hand big money to DeRozan so early into the season (thereby hindering his trade value)?

          I too see Ross as a very good, traditional starting SG in the future. I don't see the same skill/killer instinct/upside in DeRozan's game (never have). I thought DeRozan would be a great 6th man, but certainly not at his new $9.5M contract!
          Last edited by CalgaryRapsFan; Mon Jan 28, 2013, 02:04 PM.

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          • #20
            Bryan has narrow sights when it comes to players, he gets his mind made up, and often it looks like bravado in contract negotiations. Look at me, I am the big guy with the money sack. Which never helps our club, and in the end, even sometimes surprises the players.

            As a result, most of the players we go after, never fetch the same value when we need to deal. Hence we get crippled when Bryan's (sarcasm on) "best quality", to correct his mistakes, (which means buying for 125% and selling for 75%) fetches poorer talent with each iteration.

            EDIT: His weakness is in transactions, the leakage in asset value is his biggest deficiency as a GM. This club has lost so much on trades, and on so many consecutive occasions, that I would never hire another GM this inept at it, yes he is good speaker and PR person.

            I really think he should of been fired on the spot when it became obvious he could not retain Bosh. (regardless what you think of the Bosh getting max, just the fact that that option no longer was there on the table, just disappeared *poof*, should of meant his goose. A franchise can not afford to loose a perennial allstar for nothing.)
            Last edited by BasketballCrush; Mon Jan 28, 2013, 02:07 PM.

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            • #21
              As much as we all know Toronto is a beautiful city - it remains in the shadows when it comes to luring free agents.

              I guess that is where I understand that a talented young SG under contract around $9-10M, is an asset better than $10M in cap space to go find talent ... sign assets, and build through trades ... just waiting for that trades part (can't happen for Demar until summer anyhow).

              Off topic, sorry.

              T-Ross in year 4 (where Demar is now) is a scary thought ... hopefully he doesn't end up as sweetener in a deal.
              The only way to bag a classy lady is to give her two tickets to the gun show... and see if she likes the goods.

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              • #22
                BasketballCrush wrote: View Post
                A franchise can not afford to loose a perennial allstar for nothing.)
                It's happened 3 times in this team's history (McGrady (although not an allstar when he was here), Carter and Bosh). It takes eons for a franchise to recover from such gross displays of asset mismanagement.

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                • #23
                  The sad thing is that Babcock did better than Bryan, when it came to getting something for the investment the franchise made in Carter. Toronto completely lost out on Bosh under Bryan's tenure. I still don't know how he did not lose his job that year. That is a serious asset that got lost on his watch.
                  Last edited by BasketballCrush; Mon Jan 28, 2013, 03:13 PM.

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                  • #24
                    DeRozan was only in college for 1 year as apposed to T Ross who stayed for 2 -3 years

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                    • #25
                      Papa Burgundy wrote: View Post
                      As much as we all know Toronto is a beautiful city - it remains in the shadows when it comes to luring free agents.

                      I guess that is where I understand that a talented young SG under contract around $9-10M, is an asset better than $10M in cap space to go find talent
                      I think this says it all. Star-type Talents are NOT coming here voluntarily. Maybe tomorrow, but NEVER in our past history - unless Turk is being defined as a Star talent. That includes when Raps were No. 1 in the East.

                      For all the bitching against BC (and he does deserve it for parts of Raptor history), the Canadian aspect is a fundamental flaw overlooked in many arguments thrown around here, and other Blog sites. As far as I'm concerned, Colangelo has made good draft picks. Andrea - for all his warts - was the best talent [as per Smitch], taking into account (as Smitch said), the concerns with Roy's knees. Davis & DeRozen were considered picks that "fell" to the Raptors. Jonas is our chance at a Star talent - I really believe he will find himself in the All-Star game within 2 - 3 years (if not sooner). And Ross - despite going higher then expected - may turn out to be a real gem.

                      This is not to suggest everything is rosy with BC, but I'd like to see some quality GM (who's willing to relocate to the Great White North), be able to draw talent to Toronto - even if we manage to develop another Vince, or almost-equivalent, and are a play-off team.


                      BasketballCrush wrote: View Post
                      The sad thing is that Babcock did better than Bryan, when it came to getting something for the investment the franchise made in Carter. Toronto completely lost out on Bosh under Bryan's tenure. I still don't know how he did not lose his job that year. That is a serious asset that got lost on his watch.
                      Really?
                      You do remember Alonso - I'm not playing here / Okay .. you're released & here's 9 million bucks - Mourning.

                      Dec 17/2004 Trade
                      To Toronto
                      Eric Williams
                      Aaron Williams
                      Alonzo Mourning - bought out [Medical issues ??? wtf], and shortly after, joined Miami & won a Ring in 2006.
                      2005 1st Round pick [16th] - Joey Graham
                      2006 1st Round pick [20th] - Traded to New York [Renaldo Balkman] along with Jalen Rose for Antonio Davis, who was released 2 months later (back issues)

                      To New Jersey
                      VINCE CARTER

                      [Edit]
                      So .... Raps got Eric & Aaron Williams + Joey ..... for Vince Carter - the best Raptor player to this date. And way better then Chris Bosh ... IMO.
                      .

                      July 2010 Trade
                      To Toronto
                      Toronto's 1st pick comes back
                      Miami's 1st pick - later traded for James Johnson
                      14.5 Million Trade Exception - partially used.

                      To Miami - Sign & Trade
                      Chris "the air smells different here" Bosh

                      If I'm not mistaken, Kyle Lowry wouldn't be here, had the pick not returned to Toronto (ie. Can't have lottery protected picks "floating" out there - so to speak)


                      Nilanka wrote: View Post
                      Let's not forget that DeRozan had a double team magnet (i.e Bosh) to help his offense as a rookie. Ross doesn't have that luxury.
                      Good point.
                      However, from my perspective - and as Papa B says below - there are a number of variables that come into play. My summary is:

                      1) Demar played against Starters, while Ross learns against Bench guys
                      2) Demar played WITH Starters, but was 3rd Option (behind Bosh & Bargs) - less focus from Opponent


                      Papa Burgundy wrote: View Post
                      There are so many variables ... but I'd go with minutes as the big comparison.

                      Eventhough starting seems like more was given to Demar, when is a rookie more likely to get some looks or a role - with the A unit, or a bench mob?

                      What is of real interest is how TRoss already has signs of so many pieces to his game. He is:

                      -Arguably the Raptors best 3pt threat (only better % from PG's who may not shoot as often)
                      -Able to create his own shot off the dribble. Not much in the lane, but his jumper gets lots of space for what he needs!
                      -Gets in the lane for steals, without cheating and giving up blow-bys. Many of his highlights are fast breaks where he created it.

                      Demar is a good NBA player, and I think his contract is not too far off his value. I do think TRoss is the preferred option of the future if he starts to add some consistency to his game. SG's need to be able to space the floor with shooting.
                      As you say, Terrence seems to have more going for him - even comparing 3+ years of DD to Rookie Ross.

                      1) Better Defender
                      2) Better perimeter shooter (and Ross just started)
                      3) Demar can fly - when given the opportunity - however, TRoss can really fly

                      As for Demar's contract, like it was said above, 10 million cap space doesn't seem to get us much. We had 14.5 million from the Bosh trade. Suffice to say, that large cap space fell to the supply & demand weakness. Today - with the new CBA - it has more weight.

                      .
                      Last edited by RapthoseLeafs; Mon Jan 28, 2013, 06:19 PM.

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                      • #26
                        DeRozan has to start playing the 3 so Ross can start at the 2 there I said it...

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                        • #27
                          RapthoseLeafs, 2 first round picks is still better than what we got for Bosh (regardless what Kelly made them turn out to be, it could of easily been Granger). Babcock was bad, but not Bryan Colangelo bad.
                          Last edited by BasketballCrush; Mon Jan 28, 2013, 07:42 PM.

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                          • #28
                            Hopefully we don't need to choose between them and Demar can slide over to the 3 (as mentioned above). Gerald Wallace clocks in a 6 ft 7 and 220 lbs, compared to 6 ft 7 and 216lbs for Demar (espn). Didn't see the game after the first quarter as I had to study but I'm pretty impressed by Demar's 9 assists - he's figuring out what to do when those double teams come. If you look at his assist numbers as the season has gone on, the progression has be slow and steady:
                            Nov - 1.9; Dec - 2.1; Jan - 2.3; last 5 games - 5.6.

                            If I had to pick, though, I'd take Ross. His shot is too pretty to pass up (although maybe he needs to learn when to pass it up), and he's already the better defender.

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                            • #29
                              For arguments sake, Demar Derozan is the better player as of now. In five years, maybe Terrence Ross. Demar Derozan is the main focal point for opposing teams' defenses now and he is still managing to score. He is constantly working on his game and is never satisfied. As for Terrence Ross, he is a streaky shooter with good form, and he has freak athleticism. To compare them both in their rookie years, they are pretty much identical. A lot of raw talent and showed/s flashes of greatness. If the two of them stay together in Toronto, it will be a bright future! This season is a bust, but the next few years will be very exciting.

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                              • #30
                                Holy shit why is Bryan Colangelo still here?

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