The Trade That Never Was: Jose for Tyson Chandler? or Rudy Gay?

[joey_hesketh]

Was thinking about it .. .did MJ actually do us a favour by reneging on the deal a few years back? OR in Light of Tyson Chandlers 3rd straight 20-rebound Game, was that still the better trade if we could have had it?

[omgsomuchpotential]

Tyson is good and all, but Rudy is just a superior talent - creates his own offense with ease, is a good defender, while Chandler is very steady and good-if-not-great defender (not phenomenal/dominant though) and has a below average offense. Even though 7 footers are of extra value, with JV in the picture I think that is negated as well.

Rudy all day long.

[Rapstor4Life]

its funny when you put it like that... If we had Chandler Dallas wouldnt have won that championship and it would have been most likely OKC, and BC wouldnt have took DC from Dallas to coach here and Chandlet would most likely be looking for a way out of the city by now... very strange when you think about it all.

Glad things turned out in the end I always watched Memphis to see Rudy Gay play he really is a allstar snub.

[Mediumcore]

I think Chandler's defense is better than Gay's offense, but on this Raptors team it's Gay's skill set that is of more value. If Melo wasn't playing for New York, Chandler would have the same affect as he did playing in Charlotte. So my vote goes to Gay.

[omgsomuchpotential]

I think Chandler's defense is better than Gay's offense, but on this Raptors team it's Gay's skill set that is of more value. If Melo wasn't playing for New York, Chandler would have the same affect as he did playing in Charlotte. So my vote goes to Gay.

I think that on a championship contender calibre team players like Gay is a MUST have, while players like Chandler aren't of equal importance. I like Chandler, and even though he was selected DPOY '12, I think you're either overestimating his defense or underestimating Gay's offense.

[Nilanka]

We probably wouldn't have drafted Jonas if we had Chandler.

[omgsomuchpotential]

We probably wouldn't have drafted Jonas if we had Chandler.

Indeed, while speculating on alternate past events you need to take into consideration the butterfly effect.

[ebrian]

If we had Chandler then Colangelo would have correctly drafted Kemba Walker and we'd still have our first round pick. Calderon could still be traded for Rudy Gay.

Basically, today's roster would be:

c: Chandler
pf: Johnson
sf: Gay
sg: DeRozan
pg: Walker

[Nilanka]

If we had Chandler then Colangelo would have correctly drafted Kemba Walker and we'd still have our first round pick. Calderon could still be traded for Rudy Gay.

Basically, today's roster would be:

c: Chandler
pf: Johnson
sf: Gay
sg: DeRozan
pg: Walker

Calderon would've been part of the Chandler trade. So he wouldn't have been available to acquire Gay

[Stahmenah_Vybz]

Calderon would've been part of the Chandler trade. So he wouldn't have been available to acquire Gay

LOL good one. Chandler is good but we would have still been working now a funk. At least with gay, others might be more inclined to sign with raps than without him.

[Nilanka]

LOL good one. Chandler is good but we would have still been working now a funk. At least with gay, others might be more inclined to sign with raps than without him.

Good point, and something that's not stated enough. Gay combined with Lowry, DeRozan, and Jonas might be something free agents see as an up-and-coming core.

Acquiring Gay has somewhat increased Toronto's status as a free agent destination. Now, we just need to start winning some games, lol.

[Nilanka]

Ah damnit. Replace Bargnani with Calderon then. Instead of Detroit, go with Lakers.

Memphis wanted/needed SF depth with Prince and Daye. Lakers would likely only trade Gasol

[heinz57]

i dont think it's fair to compare the two trades

AT THE TIME, the Chandler trade made all the sense in the world... and the immediate impact would have been huge..

seriously, Aaron Gray is an upgrade from the bigs we had that year... Alabi, Dorsey, David Anderesen, Ed Davis hadn't grown pubes yet... all we had was Bargs and Amir, and a buncha guys who barely showed up every 4-5 games..

And losing Jose that year wouldn't have left us as high and dry at PG as now... back then we had Jack, Bayless, and Barbosa.. right now, there's nobody to share Lowry's minutes other than Lucas... and if Lowry goes down, there really isn't anyone who can slide over and take over point duties in his stead..

[ebrian]

Calderon would've been part of the Chandler trade. So he wouldn't have been available to acquire Gay

My bad. But we would've still had the first round pick that went in the Lowry trade. So replace Calderon with 2013 First round pick and Bargnani going to Lakers instead of Jose to Detroit. Done and done. No Bargnani. Even better than my original scenario.

[Matt52]

That is a good question.

There are too many variables.

Personally, I'd rather have Rudy and am pleased the way Calderon's contract worked out to benefit the team moving forward.

[ebrian]

Memphis wanted/needed SF depth with Prince and Daye. Lakers would likely only trade Gasol

Memphis didn't need/want anything except someone to take Calderon. Just sub another team.. say, Milwaukee for Ilyasova or Minnesota for Kirilenko. Whatever works.

My head hurts.

[Axel]

Super tough to guage. Agree witht he earlier comment that if we get Chandler then we likely don't have Casey as the coach. Far too many dominoes to track. Chandler would have been a huge improvement to the team's identity at the time and perhaps we chart a different course entirely. (Perhaps we win enough to keep Triano as coach *gulp*).

I like Chandler and think he is exactly what this team has been missing, but if JV can fill that role and Gay turns out to fulfill the scoring need, then perhaps things are best as is.

[BallaBalla]

i dont think it's fair to compare the two trades

AT THE TIME, the Chandler trade made all the sense in the world... and the immediate impact would have been huge..

seriously, Aaron Gray is an upgrade from the bigs we had that year... Alabi, Dorsey, David Anderesen, Ed Davis hadn't grown pubes yet... all we had was Bargs and Amir, and a buncha guys who barely showed up every 4-5 games..

And losing Jose that year wouldn't have left us as high and dry at PG as now... back then we had Jack, Bayless, and Barbosa.. right now, there's nobody to share Lowry's minutes other than Lucas... and if Lowry goes down, there really isn't anyone who can slide over and take over point duties in his stead..

that's exactly how we should look at it....trading jose from a few years ago for chandler pre championship (and diaw I should mention)

or Jose of today and Ed Davis for Rudy Gay

I think that contextually, turning Jose into Tyson chandler and Diaw at the time would have been a stroke of genius. Bargnani was not the dud he is today, Calderon was not as good as is today, and we would have had a really serviceable front court combination similar to the one which Dallas used to win the championship.

At the same time, Bargnani ended up being terrible, so we would have built our whole team around him. Chandler would have left because...well...he just came from charlotte...so he would have been suicidal by the time he got to us, let alone after playing with Bargnani. We also had Jay Triano as a coach (i think?), who was BY FAR the worst coach in the history of the league

That being said....The Gay trade wins all day. He will probably be an all star on our team, and this allows us to grow guys like Amir into high value players, and we are in the same place we probably would have been with Chandler, but with upside that lasts more than a couple of years

[heinz57]

that's exactly how we should look at it....trading jose from a few years ago for chandler pre championship (and diaw I should mention)

or Jose of today and Ed Davis for Rudy Gay

I think that contextually, turning Jose into Tyson chandler and Diaw at the time would have been a stroke of genius. Bargnani was not the dud he is today, Calderon was not as good as is today, and we would have had a really serviceable front court combination similar to the one which Dallas used to win the championship.

At the same time, Bargnani ended up being terrible, so we would have built our whole team around him. Chandler would have left because...well...he just came from charlotte...so he would have been suicidal by the time he got to us, let alone after playing with Bargnani. We also had Jay Triano as a coach (i think?), who was BY FAR the worst coach in the history of the league

That being said....The Gay trade wins all day. He will probably be an all star on our team, and this allows us to grow guys like Amir into high value players, and we are in the same place we probably would have been with Chandler, but with upside that lasts more than a couple of years

if i looked at things in terms of the time period...

like, the Chandler trade in 2010, on the 2010 Raptors... with no outlook into the future... purely looking at that specific time and team... vs Rudy Gay and the current team and his impact on THIS season..

i'd say i'd prefer the 2010 trade.. it addressed a desperate team need at the time, without sacrificing too much.. ed davis was barely mentionable, and giving up jose wasn't too bad since we had a decent arsenal of stand-ins at PG

but really it's a pointless argument i'd be making... because right now i love the Rudy Gay trade, despite it leaving a blackhole at PG position

[Mediumcore]

I think that on a championship contender calibre team players like Gay is a MUST have, while players like Chandler aren't of equal importance. I like Chandler, and even though he was selected DPOY '12, I think you're either overestimating his defense or underestimating Gay's offense.

I beg to differ and I'm pretty sure there are a few people in Dallas that would feel differently as well. The reality is that you need good offensive and defensive players to win. If you use New York as an example a case could be made that if you took either Chandler or Melo out of the line up they would not be a winning team.

But as I mentioned in my previous post, this particular Raptors squad has more of a need for what Rudy Gay brings to the table as opposed to what Tyson Chandler brings.