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Thread: The "future" is about building around Gay

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    Default The "future" is about building around Gay

    As of today, we have about 1% chance of making the playoff consider Rudy Gay is out with back spasms, who knows when he will return to the lineups. DeRozan is not gonna make this team any better and without Gay's presence, he's just a mediocre SG. Allen Anderson will keep on jacking up shots after shots, a 3rd stringer SG on a better teams and almost non existent on a championship calibre team. Lowry is not his former self when he played for the Rockets where practically offense are going through him, we either switch to an offensive minded coach or trade Lowry for a pass first PG. Bargnani is just atrocious to play but let him ride the storm till the end of the season, perhaps we can find a better suitor for him.

    Terrence Ross needs to be packaged along with our expiring for a backup SG, someone in the mold of Redick who can hit open jumpers or beyond the arc. Amir Johnson is not our PF of the future, a decent backup PF/C, a glue guy, picture Oakley. We need a someone versatile of a PF to keep up with the new wave of PF in today's basketball scenario (Someone in the calibre of KG, CB4, Al Jeff, Josh Smith, Boozer, D.West, L.Aldridge), possibly address that through the draft (buy a pick through trade with Bargs??) Valanciunas need another year or two to keep up with the rest of the center in this league, to me, he just has as much ceiling as Enes Kanter, Omer Asik, at the best Pekovic. His not in the mold of Sabonis, Gortat or Igauskaus at their prime. To look forward for next year, we need to build around Rudy Gay. Remember this is Gay's team now, all others are just supporting players and most are expendable.
    Last edited by Arsenalist; Sun Mar 3rd, 2013 at 07:38 PM. Reason: Added a title that makes sense.

  2. #2
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Trading Ross? No.
    "You never heard of DeMar just google him, the defense don't know what to do wit him"

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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
    Trading Ross? No.
    Trading Ross? For the right price? Yes. Trading Derozan? Yes, for the right price. In my opinion, JV, Gay, Lowry, and Amir are the only untouchables...

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    Raptors Republic All-Star enlightenment's Avatar
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    Quote RaptorReuben wrote: View Post
    Trading Ross? For the right price? Yes. Trading Derozan? Yes, for the right price. In my opinion, JV, Gay, Lowry, and Amir are the only untouchables...
    The right price... and what is the right price for untapped potential like Ross? Ross is untouchable, there is no one in the league that will offer us what we would sell him for. Therefor there is no right price. Out of the 300 odd players and 60 picks in next years draft, NOTHING will settle a deal for Terrence Ross.
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    Raptors Republic All-Star Red and White's Avatar
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    Quote enlightenment wrote: View Post
    The right price... and what is the right price for untapped potential like Ross? Ross is untouchable, there is no one in the league that will offer us what we would sell him for. Therefor there is no right price. Out of the 300 odd players and 60 picks in next years draft, NOTHING will settle a deal for Terrence Ross.
    Id take James Harden and a second round draft pick.

    In seriousness, I do not understand why some consider Amir to be untouchable. The whole point of someone being "untouchable" is that they would be very difficult, if not impossible, to replace. Guys like Lowry (who the team shopped at one point of this season), Amir, and to some extent Demar (even though I like him and Gay together), are all "touchable".

    JV, Ross and Gay are the only ones I would deem untouchable, but that does not mean all the other guys I want to trade.

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    Administrator Arsenalist's Avatar
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    Quote Red and White wrote: View Post
    Id take James Harden and a second round draft pick.

    In seriousness, I do not understand why some consider Amir to be untouchable. The whole point of someone being "untouchable" is that they would be very difficult, if not impossible, to replace. Guys like Lowry (who the team shopped at one point of this season), Amir, and to some extent Demar (even though I like him and Gay together), are all "touchable".

    JV, Ross and Gay are the only ones I would deem untouchable, but that does not mean all the other guys I want to trade.
    Oh man, James Harden. I actually LOL'd and my kid said, "Daddy, why are you laughing, did you read something totally unreasonable on the internet?".

    If you don't rate Amir or Ross, why do you think Houston would? And to top it off they'll give you their prized free-agent signing who is widely considered to be a max-player back in return.

    Trading Amir makes zero sense. He's one of the most consistent players on the team, if not the. I agree he's not a starter but he's a productive NBA player who has learned how to play consistently, which is the biggest step one can take. He is known quantity who you can rely on. That, and he's got a reasonable contract given what the going rates are. You don't trade a guy like that.

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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote enlightenment wrote: View Post
    The right price... and what is the right price for untapped potential like Ross? Ross is untouchable, there is no one in the league that will offer us what we would sell him for. Therefor there is no right price. Out of the 300 odd players and 60 picks in next years draft, NOTHING will settle a deal for Terrence Ross.
    If you can get a Paul Millsap back, I'd take it in a heartbeat for Bargnani + Ross + 1st rounder (if playoffs aren't made). There IS a right price for every player, regardless of how good they are, how untapped their potential is (personally, I don't see Ross' potential as high as everyone sees it as) and how bad/good contract is. Every player is expendable, it depends on what the management depicts the player to be. Whether an asset, untouchable, core, etc.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran white men can't jump's Avatar
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    Quote RaptorReuben wrote: View Post
    If you can get a Paul Millsap back, I'd take it in a heartbeat for Bargnani + Ross + 1st rounder (if playoffs aren't made). There IS a right price for every player, regardless of how good they are, how untapped their potential is (personally, I don't see Ross' potential as high as everyone sees it as) and how bad/good contract is. Every player is expendable, it depends on what the management depicts the player to be. Whether an asset, untouchable, core, etc.
    Wow, you'd give up a pick and Ross for a guy who's never made an all-star game....I don't know how you judge talent then. Millsap is not exactly going to bust out more than he has. Talk about overrating talent. You'll trade away Ross, who you can't failry judge with the sporadic playing time, is much younger and does have all-star potential (he's at least as athletic and more skilled than Demar was as a rookie, and Demar's tured out pretty well) for a guy who has never made an all-star appearance and turns 29 next season (and who will also possibly have a long, costly contract). I would happily take Millsap, but Demar and Ross are off the table.

    *I don't understand how some people can become so impatient so quickly with young, high potential players, even if that does just turn out to be a valuable bench piece. It takes at least 2-3 seasons before judging someone's ceiling starts becoming easier.
    Last edited by white men can't jump; Sun Mar 3rd, 2013 at 04:11 PM.

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    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Quote RaptorReuben wrote: View Post
    Trading Ross? For the right price? Yes. Trading Derozan? Yes, for the right price. In my opinion, JV, Gay, Lowry, and Amir are the only untouchables...
    What exactly is the right price? Unless we're getting back a perennial all star Ross ain't going anywhere.
    "You never heard of DeMar just google him, the defense don't know what to do wit him"

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    Raptors Republic All-Star iblastoff's Avatar
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    Ross' "untouchable" status seems to be waning. Within the subset of shining rookies this season, Ross has definitely not been one of them. Granted his minutes have been stripped but the flashes we got from him lately have been disappointing. We got him as a shooter yet we only know him as a high flying dunker. This team desperately needs a reliable 3 point machine. Is that what were hoping he turns out to be?
    Last edited by iblastoff; Sun Mar 3rd, 2013 at 12:09 PM.

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    Quote iblastoff wrote: View Post
    Ross' "untouchable" status seems to be waning. Within the subset of shining rookies this season, Ross has definitely not been one of them. Granted his minutes have been stripped but the flashes we got from him lately have been disappointing. We got him as a shooter yet we only know him as a high flying dunker. This team desperately needs a reliable 3 point machine. Is that what were hoping he turns out to be?
    +1.

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    The reason we dont see him as untouchable is because our coaching staff refuse to give him minutes. Maybe he is not deserving i do not know but everything i've seen so far the kid just needs some run and experience. Looking at him on the bench he looks so demoralized and rightfully so. The hardest part for me to understand is how after ross or JV make a mistake they are yanked, when AA does whatever he pleases Casey decides to keep him out there for what seems like forever. This also goes for AB who lets just hope we are trying to increase trade value and still don't believe in him because the dude is garbage.

    I am a huge fan of the coaching staff, but they (or casey) needs to go. Our offence does not suit our players so we either need new team or new coach...

    Untouchables Ross, JV, Gay and imo demar. Everyone hates on demar for no reason. Please explain to me why you hate demar? people said he couldn't play with Gay now hes shining with him, said he couldn't pass hes passing, his shot has improved every year same with his play making skills, his handle has improved but still needs some work. The kid is hardest worker on team and people want to get rid of him because he works his ass off and loves TO ? ... i dont get it...

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    Raptors Republic All-Star iblastoff's Avatar
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    Quote Burnit482 wrote: View Post
    The reason we dont see him as untouchable is because our coaching staff refuse to give him minutes. Maybe he is not deserving i do not know but everything i've seen so far the kid just needs some run and experience. Looking at him on the bench he looks so demoralized and rightfully so. The hardest part for me to understand is how after ross or JV make a mistake they are yanked, when AA does whatever he pleases Casey decides to keep him out there for what seems like forever. This also goes for AB who lets just hope we are trying to increase trade value and still don't believe in him because the dude is garbage.

    I am a huge fan of the coaching staff, but they (or casey) needs to go. Our offence does not suit our players so we either need new team or new coach...

    Untouchables Ross, JV, Gay and imo demar. Everyone hates on demar for no reason. Please explain to me why you hate demar? people said he couldn't play with Gay now hes shining with him, said he couldn't pass hes passing, his shot has improved every year same with his play making skills, his handle has improved but still needs some work. The kid is hardest worker on team and people want to get rid of him because he works his ass off and loves TO ? ... i dont get it...
    I definitely see demar as untouchable, especially his growth year after year. Some people have ridiculous expectations. Its like unless the lineup isn't full of lebrons than we should get rid of them.

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    Super Moderator ReubenJRD's Avatar
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    Quote iblastoff wrote: View Post
    I definitely see demar as untouchable, especially his growth year after year. Some people have ridiculous expectations. Its like unless the lineup isn't full of lebrons than we should get rid of them.
    I don't see him untouchable, just incredibly hard to trade. Because, his progression is impressive, and there's not many other players like him. If there are, teams won't trade their player.

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    Raptors Republic Starter special1's Avatar
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    Quote Burnit482 wrote: View Post
    The reason we dont see him as untouchable is because our coaching staff refuse to give him minutes. Maybe he is not deserving i do not know but everything i've seen so far the kid just needs some run and experience. Looking at him on the bench he looks so demoralized and rightfully so. The hardest part for me to understand is how after ross or JV make a mistake they are yanked, when AA does whatever he pleases Casey decides to keep him out there for what seems like forever. This also goes for AB who lets just hope we are trying to increase trade value and still don't believe in him because the dude is garbage.

    I am a huge fan of the coaching staff, but they (or casey) needs to go. Our offence does not suit our players so we either need new team or new coach...

    Untouchables Ross, JV, Gay and imo demar. Everyone hates on demar for no reason. Please explain to me why you hate demar? people said he couldn't play with Gay now hes shining with him, said he couldn't pass hes passing, his shot has improved every year same with his play making skills, his handle has improved but still needs some work. The kid is hardest worker on team and people want to get rid of him because he works his ass off and loves TO ? ... i dont get it...
    I think NO ONE should be untouchable (EVERYONE should be available for the right price - if it improves our team)

    However, ONLY Rudy, JV and Demar (a VERY good 2nd or 3rd option) should be considered untouchable.

    I dont get all this love for an unproven rookie in Ross. I actually wish we could've sent him to Memphis instead of ED. I guess they weren't interested in Ross (I think Ross would learn a lot from someone like Tony Allen). Oh well......I really hope Ross turns out to prove my wishes wrong!

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    Raptors Republic All-Star TRex's Avatar
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    The only untouchables on this team are Gay and JV. That's it.

    You all know what i think of Lowry(see the Lowry thread). Ross is all potential. But i do think though that his skillset is a much better fit on this team than DeRozan just because he can shoot and is a much better defender. Question is, how much he wants it?

    DeRozan on the other hand is overrated. The guy struggles and shit the bed whenever the team needed him the most. Last night's game was a great example. He also always disappear whenever the Raps play a tough physical defensive team. Play him physical and i guarantee DeRozan will struggle.

    If/when the Raps make the playoffs next year. I guarantee DeRozan will be a non factor because playoff basketball is tough basketball.
    Last edited by TRex; Sun Mar 3rd, 2013 at 03:54 PM.
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    Raptors Republic Rookie RobertArchibald's Avatar
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    Quote TRex wrote: View Post
    The only untouchables on this team are Gay and JV. That's it.

    You all know what i think of Lowry(see the Lowry thread). Ross is all potential. But i do think though that his skillset is a much better fit on this team than DeRozan just because he can shoot and is a much better defender. Question is, how much he wants it?

    DeRozan on the other hand is overrated. The guy struggles and shit the bed whenever the team needed him the most. Last night's game was a great example. He also always disappear whenever the Raps play a tough physical defensive team. Play him physical and i guarantee DeRozan will struggle.

    If/when the Raps make the playoffs next year. I guarantee DeRozan will be a non factor because playoff basketball is tough basketball.
    What you're saying is DD isn't perfect. He's not an All-Star but he is much better than I thought he was going to be and that's a testament to his hard work. I think he can be an excellent piece next to Gay. Every season he improves something. He's also starting to get the respect of the officials now. I remember when this started happening for Bosh to the point where he would get a call virtually every time he took the ball to the rack. That's an invaluable piece to have on your team for playoffs and for physical teams. As for him not being clutch, he did hit a rather tough game winner this year and this team has never really been 'his'. He's always been in the shadow of someone else in late game situations. You can see him starting to be vocal late in games and leading. That took time but it's also improving.
    There's math, and everything else is debatable.

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    Quote RobertArchibald wrote: View Post
    What you're saying is DD isn't perfect. He's not an All-Star but he is much better than I thought he was going to be and that's a testament to his hard work. I think he can be an excellent piece next to Gay. Every season he improves something. He's also starting to get the respect of the officials now. I remember when this started happening for Bosh to the point where he would get a call virtually every time he took the ball to the rack. That's an invaluable piece to have on your team for playoffs and for physical teams. As for him not being clutch, he did hit a rather tough game winner this year and this team has never really been 'his'. He's always been in the shadow of someone else in late game situations. You can see him starting to be vocal late in games and leading. That took time but it's also improving.
    He came into the draft with high potential. Ross came into his draft with scouts questioning his potential. I just don't see Ross being more than a good role player, or a solid starter.

  19. #19
    Raptors Republic Veteran NoPropsneeded's Avatar
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    Ross needs some damn time. Tomorrow night is when it should start, just give him the green light
    "You never heard of DeMar just google him, the defense don't know what to do wit him"

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    Raptors Republic All-Star TRex's Avatar
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    Quote NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
    Ross needs some damn time. Tomorrow night is when it should start, just give him the green light
    And Valanciunas. JV for some reason only played 11mins last night
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