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Is There A Scenario -- Loul Deng edition

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  • #46
    imanshumpert wrote: View Post
    There is no statistical/quantitative/objective argument for DeMar hurting the team. It's illogical. Yes he takes a lot of shots, but his efficiency is about average which would classify him as a volume scorer not a chucker. Contrary to popular belief, not every player in the NBA can see consistent double teams and handle high usage while still producing effective scoring numbers and limiting turnovers.

    As for defense, every metric you look at will tell you DeRozan is average or even slightly above-average defensively, particularly when it comes to guarding his position. The people saying he's terrible on defense think that they're justified in saying so because he makes defensive errors in games. Yes, he does make defensive mistakes, as do most "average" defenders and even some above-average ones. He is not a liability on the defensive end of the floor though like some like to suggest.

    At this point some of you guys need to just go on NBA 2K14 and make these trades yourself and get it out of your system. Whether that's DeRozan for Deng, DeRozan for Waiters, DeRozan for a 10M expiring, idc. Just keep it away from the actual team.

    Sorry for contributing to this turning into yet another DD thread.
    How many times do i have to say that i do not actually want Deng. It was a tongue in cheek response to the OP.
    And seriously it sounds like you are the one who does not have a clue. There is no way derozan can be considered an average or even above average defender. I don't care what stat you are looking at. The stats have no idea what teams philosophies are on defense and doesn't take into account what the defender is SUPPOSED to be doing on any given play or scenario. Also this iso defense stat doesn't make sense because like you guys pointed out, he never guards any iso players... like ever.. unless he's forced to ie. Miami.

    I'm so tired of reading these egotistical posters on here that cant stand hearing a different opinion or point of view. Im also tired reading these type of debates over the same shit over and over let alone participating in them. Again, it was not my intention. This time im actually done lol

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    • #47
      Pass.
      “The saving of our world from pending doom will come, not through the complacent adjustment of the conforming majority, but through the creative maladjustment of a nonconforming minority.” - Martin Luther King

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      • #48
        That Zach Lowe would even mention Demar in a discussion of his All-Defense picks just goes to show how far Demar has come defensively. I honestly don't know how people continue to say he is bad/terrible defensively. If the stats don't back it up and qualitative observation doesn't back it up then all you've got left is stubbornness.

        Kyle Lowry has toned down the wildness and DeMar DeRozan has made huge strides, but neither is so good as to make me queasy about Leonard’s positioning here.
        http://grantland.com/the-triangle/ro...he-nba-awards/

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        • #49
          thead wrote: View Post
          I've been messing with cap numbers and contract situations all day (cap numbers are not my forte)

          I really believe that Loul Deng is one two pieces that could really put this team over the top.

          I put this out there to my fellow republicans...how can we get him without giving up much?
          They can cut and stretch Fields and Hayes contracts, which would likely leave enough room to sign both Deng and Lowry.

          But you say one of two pieces, which I would agree with. So then the question is how do you get that second piece without cap space? Deng/Lowry are 28-29 now, they can't wait 5 years for the Raptors to find that last piece.

          I don't mind signing Deng. But he'd be a borderline target in my view. I'd likely pass and focus on younger or better pieces.
          Last edited by BobLoblaw; Wed Apr 16, 2014, 09:39 PM.

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          • #50
            Scraptor wrote: View Post
            That Zach Lowe would even mention Demar in a discussion of his All-Defense picks just goes to show how far Demar has come defensively. I honestly don't know how people continue to say he is bad/terrible defensively. If the stats don't back it up and qualitative observation doesn't back it up then all you've got left is stubbornness.



            http://grantland.com/the-triangle/ro...he-nba-awards/
            you really think he watches raptors games???? this is the same guy that said Minnesota is a good defensive team lol. He did what u did and looked at the stats to support what u want it to.

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            • #51
              Defensive stats don't matter because they say DeMar is a good defender.

              But his TS% matters because it says he's not efficient.

              Ight

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              • #52
                Scraptor wrote: View Post
                That Zach Lowe would even mention Demar in a discussion of his All-Defense picks just goes to show how far Demar has come defensively. I honestly don't know how people continue to say he is bad/terrible defensively. If the stats don't back it up and qualitative observation doesn't back it up then all you've got left is stubbornness.



                http://grantland.com/the-triangle/ro...he-nba-awards/
                Try the Everything DD thread with recent breakdowns of his poor rotations. He isn't a good defender

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                • #53
                  OldSkoolCool wrote: View Post
                  What does the points that he brought up have to do with any trade? He does hold the ball and kill the flow quite often, there is no stat that will prove or deny this. Defensively he is not very good, defensive metrics are poor at best. Your over-reliance on stats to justify things is astonishing, especially when regarding DD. Stats are imperfect.
                  Indeed. Carlos Boozer is ranked 19th in the entire league for Defensive Rating

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                  • #54
                    FoxMachine wrote: View Post
                    cap numbers are also not my forte but just throwing it out there that id give up derozan for deng in a heartbeat... too bad cavs have no use for him
                    i hope u are joking or stoned...
                    Change the name...Give this city and this country something we can be PROUD of... something we can EMBRACE... something that REPRESENTS us... Please MLSE any name except Raptors...anything, please?

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                    • #55
                      FoxMachine wrote: View Post
                      How many times do i have to say that i do not actually want Deng. It was a tongue in cheek response to the OP.
                      And seriously it sounds like you are the one who does not have a clue. There is no way derozan can be considered an average or even above average defender. I don't care what stat you are looking at. The stats have no idea what teams philosophies are on defense and doesn't take into account what the defender is SUPPOSED to be doing on any given play or scenario. Also this iso defense stat doesn't make sense because like you guys pointed out, he never guards any iso players... like ever.. unless he's forced to ie. Miami.

                      I'm so tired of reading these egotistical posters on here that cant stand hearing a different opinion or point of view. Im also tired reading these type of debates over the same shit over and over let alone participating in them. Again, it was not my intention. This time im actually done lol
                      lol?... if u would trade derozan for deng u would be making a bad trade period... or u have weird sense of humour, if that was a joke...
                      Change the name...Give this city and this country something we can be PROUD of... something we can EMBRACE... something that REPRESENTS us... Please MLSE any name except Raptors...anything, please?

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        FoxMachine wrote: View Post
                        you really think he watches raptors games???? this is the same guy that said Minnesota is a good defensive team lol. He did what u did and looked at the stats to support what u want it to.
                        Of all the american nba writers, Lowe spends by far the most time talking about the Raptors. His wife is from Toronto and he's openly said he watches their games and cheers for them.

                        Further, Lowe is one of the most knowledgeable writers out there. If I hadn't ever watched a game and had to trust him or you, well, I'm not second guessing Lowe for a second.
                        "Bruno?
                        Heh, if he is in the D-league still in a few years I will be surprised.
                        He's terrible."

                        -Superjudge, 7/23

                        Hope you're wrong.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          BobLoblaw wrote: View Post
                          They can cut and stretch Fields and Hayes contracts, which would likely leave enough room to sign both Deng and Lowry.

                          But you say one of two pieces, which I would agree with. So then the question is how do you get that second piece without cap space? Deng/Lowry are 28-29 now, they can't wait 5 years for the Raptors to find that last piece.

                          I don't mind signing Deng. But he'd be a borderline target in my view. I'd likely pass and focus on younger or better pieces.
                          Stretching Fields and Hayes gets you enough cap space to sign those two IF you let Patterson and Vasquez and de Colo walk for nothing. And IF Deng AND Lowry would take about 10M each.
                          twitter.com/dhackett1565

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                          • #58
                            stooley wrote: View Post
                            Of all the american nba writers, Lowe spends by far the most time talking about the Raptors. His wife is from Toronto and he's openly said he watches their games and cheers for them.

                            Further, Lowe is one of the most knowledgeable writers out there. If I hadn't ever watched a game and had to trust him or you, well, I'm not second guessing Lowe for a second.
                            cool... you're right. Derozan is an amazing defender.

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                            • #59
                              FoxMachine wrote: View Post
                              cool... you're right. Derozan is an amazing defender.
                              just saying, you're discrediting a guy who knows his shit.
                              "Bruno?
                              Heh, if he is in the D-league still in a few years I will be surprised.
                              He's terrible."

                              -Superjudge, 7/23

                              Hope you're wrong.

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                stooley wrote: View Post
                                just saying, you're discrediting a guy who knows his shit.
                                if Zach Lowe picked Demar for one of his all-defense picks he is discrediting himself. No one on the planet other than a few homer Toronto fans would agree with him.

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