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Tim Leiweke Apologizes to Colangelo

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  • #31
    LBF wrote: View Post
    I've been a member here for a few years and before that was on RF. I don't remember anyone when Bosh was still here criticizing BC for trying to build around him.

    He only started getting criticized after Bosh left. Maybe a few when Bosh wasn't traded by the deadline. But thing is BC was trying to convince Bosh to stick around, he was trying to make the playoffs, trying to win now. It back fired and than (rightfully so) everyone turned on him.
    I think there were lots of RR posters who were strongly opposed to BC attempting to build a team around Bosh. Personally, I first started coming to RR the summer of 2009, prior to Bosh's last season, specifically to see how other fans felt about that plan and to voice my desire to trade Bosh before he became a free agent when many more potential trading partners were in the mix (ie: Philly, NYK, Houston - and I didn't believe for a second that he would re-sign here). I was a big Bosh fan and felt he'd be a great "Robin", but knew we desperately needed our "Batman" (similar to the Shaq/Wade combo in Miami). When Bosh became the face of the franchise and key marketing tool, I was worried that the team thought highly of him - he put up big numbers as the best player on a bad team, but should never have been made the #1. I remember that I was not alone in this, as many posters were concerned about the Raptors future if Bosh was built 'around', instead of 'with'.

    TL should have just fired BC outright, instead of offering him a different executive position. All of this would have been avoided.

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    • #32
      Craig wrote: View Post
      All due respect Pele, I'm pretty sure I am not missing anything here. Perhaps when a person feels like stating a guy should be "booted and pissed on" when speaking of a Managerial dismissal in pro sports may actually be missing the point more.

      Business and the politics of corporate structure, culture, and public identity are pretty complicated man, maybe you don't think they are, and thats your right, to have that opinion, I don't happen to agree.
      I think you're being a tad oversensitive. Firing a guy after leading a franchise to 7 years of failure and bringing in a new leader who is bound to talk about his vision/strategy for the team (which will be different from the old guy, otherwise why fire the old guy), is going to inevitably lead to some "disrespecting" of the old leader. BC's firing was part of a significant internal management overhaul, to create a new culture and new outlook for the team and its fans. Stating the facts and talking openly/honestly is refreshing, especially for an organization that desperately needed a change. Speaking positively about the "new" will be a slap in the face of the "old", but when the "old" was such a collosal failure, what's the big deal? I would have been irked if the new leadership team had come in and not acknowledged the failures and disappointment of the past 7 years!

      Any negatives said about BC were in reference to the results he produced, not in reference to him as a person. There were no personal attacks and BC was even given another executive position within the organization, specifically because of his success in other areas (ie: growing basketball in Canada, relations with corporate partners, relations with NBA, leading campaign to bring NBA all-star game to Canada, etc...) and the respect TL had for him as an executive. I personally saw no reason for TL to apologize to anybody.

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      • #33
        CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
        I think you're being a tad oversensitive. Firing a guy after leading a franchise to 7 years of failure and bringing in a new leader who is bound to talk about his vision/strategy for the team (which will be different from the old guy, otherwise why fire the old guy), is going to inevitably lead to some "disrespecting" of the old leader. BC's firing was part of a significant internal management overhaul, to create a new culture and new outlook for the team and its fans. Stating the facts and talking openly/honestly is refreshing, especially for an organization that desperately needed a change. Speaking positively about the "new" will be a slap in the face of the "old", but when the "old" was such a collosal failure, what's the big deal? I would have been irked if the new leadership team had come in and not acknowledged the failures and disappointment of the past 7 years!

        Any negatives said about BC were in reference to the results he produced, not in reference to him as a person. There were no personal attacks and BC was even given another executive position within the organization, specifically because of his success in other areas (ie: growing basketball in Canada, relations with corporate partners, relations with NBA, leading campaign to bring NBA all-star game to Canada, etc...) and the respect TL had for him as an executive. I personally saw no reason for TL to apologize to anybody.
        Yet, he himself went out of his way to do so. Perhaps there were more details of the handling of it than what was made public so far? In any case, by doing so, he is either being someone's puppet, or a man owning up to mistakes. Which do you think?

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        • #34
          CalgaryRapsFan wrote: View Post
          I would have been irked if the new leadership team had come in and not acknowledged the failures and disappointment of the past 7 years!



          Whats funny, is this is exactly what I expected to happen. So TL had me from the get-go.
          No more of this pussy-footing around. If people fail to do their job, FIRE their ass.

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          • #35
            p00ka wrote: View Post
            In any case, by doing so, he is either being someone's puppet, or a man owning up to mistakes. Which do you think?
            Little of Column A and a little of Column B.

            I don't think TL is anybodies 'Puppet'; he understands that there are some sensitive media types at Toronto Star (which is exactly where the apology was made) and knew that the Star is the #1 most read paper in the city.
            Regardless of whether what Doug Smith writes is accurate, its still being consumed by the ignorant and the educated alike.

            Comment


            • #36
              joey_hesketh wrote: View Post
              Little of Column A and a little of Column B.

              I don't think TL is anybodies 'Puppet'; he understands that there are some sensitive media types at Toronto Star (which is exactly where the apology was made) and knew that the Star is the #1 most read paper in the city.
              Regardless of whether what Doug Smith writes is accurate, its still being consumed by the ignorant and the educated alike.
              Is the concept of the virtue of treating people with dignity being lost on the youth of today, in general, or just in the world of sport? There was never any criticism of the firing. There was criticism of how it was handled, and TL was a man about it and stood up and took the hit...... *shaking my head" at the " ignorant" I'm seeing at RR.

              Comment


              • #37
                p00ka wrote: View Post
                Yet, he himself went out of his way to do so. Perhaps there were more details of the handling of it than what was made public so far? In any case, by doing so, he is either being someone's puppet, or a man owning up to mistakes. Which do you think?
                Based on the Doug Smith article, my assumption is that TL was being pressed by people (ie: media) who felt he had gone too far in his assessment of the Raptors' results over the past 7 years, so he apologized for anything he said that could be perceived as "going to far". I don't believe TL is apologizing for his assessment (ie: professional criticism), but rather for anything that he said that people took as being a personal slander against BC (even if he doesn't think he ever actually crossed the line). If anything, I think it's more of a PR move, designed to smooth over any feathers that might have been inadvertently ruffled.

                Again, I personally don't think TL did go too far, nor do I think he ever personally attacked BC. TL attacked the negative results and some questionable strategic decisions that BC made as GM, while talking frankly about the franchise's history, which is mostly failure. To me, the fact that TL thought highly enough of BC as a man and an executive, to reassign him rather than fire him outright, trumps any perceived personal slights.

                As fans, we all know how dismal this franchise has been for most of its existence. I personally thought it was a breath of fresh air for mangement to speak so candidly about it, while overhauling the management team, to take the team in a new direction.

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                • #38
                  I just came in here to say...

                  Doug Smith looks like the kind of guy I could see sitting on the corner of a seedy motel room bed in a wife beater and boxer shorts eating a corned beef sandwich, while a young boy, in a similar wardrobe selection is lying on the ground in the fetal position while crying... and he yells out "Shut up!! i'll take you home to your mommy when I finish my sandwich!!" while showering the kid with spit, corned beef chunks and rye crumbs.

                  I have nothing of any real value to add to this conversation.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    heinz57 wrote: View Post
                    I just came in here to say...

                    Doug Smith looks like the kind of guy I could see sitting on the corner of a seedy motel room bed in a wife beater and boxer shorts eating a corned beef sandwich, while a young boy, in a similar wardrobe selection is lying on the ground in the fetal position while crying... and he yells out "Shut up!! i'll take you home to your mommy when I finish my sandwich!!" while showering the kid with spit, corned beef chunks and rye crumbs.

                    I have nothing of any real value to add to this conversation.
                    Of what value is this conversation? Haha. It's about a lame ass apology..
                    If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

                    Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      I think Colangelo owes this fan base an apology LONG before Lieweke owes Colangelo one.

                      Just saying...

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                      • #41
                        Nilanka wrote: View Post
                        I think Colangelo owes this fan base an apology LONG before Lieweke owes Colangelo one.

                        Just saying...
                        Why?
                        If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

                        Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          LBF wrote: View Post
                          Why?
                          Why ask why?

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                          • #43
                            p00ka wrote: View Post
                            Is the concept of the virtue of treating people with dignity being lost on the youth of today, in general, or just in the world of sport? There was never any criticism of the firing. There was criticism of how it was handled, and TL was a man about it and stood up and took the hit...... *shaking my head" at the " ignorant" I'm seeing at RR.
                            Couldn't have said it better.

                            I think some fans have turned the focus (here) towards Doug Smith, and his rant with Timmy.
                            I understand the perspective that sees Dougie as a homer type, and delusional at times. However, the point of my initial disagreement with how Tim handled things, is that it came across as unprofessional.

                            Toronto already has one barrier to deal with (Canada eh?) - so it doesn't need to exasperate the situation with an flawed management shuffle that had "Outsiders" shaking their heads. Masai knew he was in charge of basketball operations. Lieweke knew he was the overall Big Boss. Why state the obvious? Isn't this chest pumping more suitable for gorillas?

                            .

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                            • #44
                              RapthoseLeafs wrote: View Post
                              Couldn't have said it better.

                              I think some fans have turned the focus (here) towards Doug Smith, and his rant with Timmy.
                              I understand the perspective that sees Dougie as a homer type, and delusional at times. However, the point of my initial disagreement with how Tim handled things, is that it came across as unprofessional.

                              Toronto already has one barrier to deal with (Canada eh?) - so it doesn't need to exasperate the situation with an flawed management shuffle that had "Outsiders" shaking their heads. Masai knew he was in charge of basketball operations. Lieweke knew he was the overall Big Boss. Why state the obvious? Isn't this chest pumping more suitable for gorillas?

                              .
                              Were any outsiders actually shaking their heads? This seems like such a non story.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Nilanka wrote: View Post
                                Why ask why?
                                Curiosity
                                If Your Uncle Jack Helped You Off An Elephant, Would You Help Your Uncle Jack Off An Elephant?

                                Sometimes, I like to buy a book on CD and listen to it, while reading music.

                                Comment

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