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Casey setting the bar for next season: Playoffs

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  • #16
    Matt52 wrote: View Post
    Not yet but the most important part of the house is definitely done: the foundation.
    Tim Duncan is a foundation. Lebron James, Durant, Kobe, Nash, Rose, Griffin, Nowitzki, Pierce. Those guys are foundations. Pairs like Gasol/Randolph, Jefferson/Milsap - those are foundations. Groups like Afflalo/Lawson/Gallo can be foundations.

    The Raptors do not have a foundation. Building your basketball team on top of Bargnani is like building your house with a base of paper mache. Now, if JV and the 2012 pick turn out to be stars, then you've got a foundation. But that is far from a certainty.

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    • #17
      slaw wrote: View Post
      Tim Duncan is a foundation. Lebron James, Durant, Kobe, Nash, Rose, Griffin, Nowitzki, Pierce. Those guys are foundations. Pairs like Gasol/Randolph, Jefferson/Milsap - those are foundations. Groups like Afflalo/Lawson/Gallo can be foundations.

      The Raptors do not have a foundation. Building your basketball team on top of Bargnani is like building your house with a base of paper mache. Now, if JV and the 2012 pick turn out to be stars, then you've got a foundation. But that is far from a certainty.
      That is your opinion.

      Your opinion appears to be that the foundation is a player.

      My opinion is the foundation is the philosophy of the team (players, coaches, management) and everyone must be on the same page. This year has been very successful in changing the minds of what people who matter (i.e. other NBA coaches and players) think of when they hear Toronto Raptors. Toronto is no longer a joke and if you don't bring your game, they are going to beat you.

      Successful teams (i.e. championship and deep playoff runs) are built on more than talented players. They are important, very important, but they are not the only important ingredient in the recipe.

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      • #18
        slaw wrote: View Post
        The analogy doesn't work. The Raptors aren't renovating their house. They don't have a house. In fact, the Raptors don't have any part of a house. The current state of the organization is the huge hole in the ground you dig before you lay the foundation. Not only don't they have a house, they haven't even started laying the foundation yet. There is one marginal NBA starter on this roster (Bargs). We don't know who the 2012 pick is and JV hasn't played a game. Should the focus of this team really be shifting to the playoffs at this stage? Isn't this wildly premature? Isn't this exactly what happened in 2006? Why the rush to repeat a process that's a proven failure?
        The only way they have no house is if they have no players. There are lots of guys on roster.

        Not liking something doesn't negate it's existstince.

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        • #19
          Apollo wrote: View Post
          The only way they have no house is if they have no players. There are lots of guys on roster.

          Not liking something doesn't negate it's existstince.
          Maybe not all the guys are IN the house, in the sense of being on the same page, or buying into Casey's system. In fact some of the players on the Raptors could actually be forming an outhouse. A number of them played like that.

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          • #20
            Matt52 wrote: View Post
            Casey might be speaking from a future perspective. He may have an idea of what types of players or transactions are on the horizon. I fully expect come training camp the roster to be much different than it is today.

            The role players are in place (ED, AMIR, DD, JJ, LK, JC, maybe Aaron Gray)
            The fringe players don't matter (Uzoh, Alabi, Anderson, Forbes, Magloire)
            2 pillars are in place (AB and JV).

            What gets added this summer through draft, free agency, or trade is to be determined.


            Regardless of what pieces are added, there has been a shift in philosophy and expectation in the franchise. Is the house finished? Not yet but the most important part of the house is definitely done: the foundation.
            Hey hey i think Demar and Ed should be included in this foundation of yours. Ed may not start but he will definitely be a key piece off the bench.

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            • #21
              slaw wrote: View Post
              The analogy doesn't work. The Raptors aren't renovating their house. They don't have a house. In fact, the Raptors don't have any part of a house. The current state of the organization is the huge hole in the ground you dig before you lay the foundation. Not only don't they have a house, they haven't even started laying the foundation yet. There is one marginal NBA starter on this roster (Bargs). We don't know who the 2012 pick is and JV hasn't played a game. Should the focus of this team really be shifting to the playoffs at this stage? Isn't this wildly premature? Isn't this exactly what happened in 2006? Why the rush to repeat a process that's a proven failure?
              Are you confusing the Raptors with the Bobcats? I'm pretty sure we began laying down the foundation and now we are beginning to build up, As dwane casey stated.

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              • #22
                NoPropsneeded wrote: View Post
                Hey hey i think Demar and Ed should be included in this foundation of yours. Ed may not start but he will definitely be a key piece off the bench.
                With the way I looked at things in that comment, no players are in the foundation.

                You might argue ED or DD should be in the pillars with AB or JV though. I don't agree but that would fit better with my line of thinking.

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                • #23
                  ED and DD are wayy more expendable than AB and JV.
                  NBADoppelgangers.tumblr.com

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                  • #24
                    slaw wrote: View Post
                    The analogy doesn't work. The Raptors aren't renovating their house. They don't have a house. In fact, the Raptors don't have any part of a house. The current state of the organization is the huge hole in the ground you dig before you lay the foundation. Not only don't they have a house, they haven't even started laying the foundation yet. There is one marginal NBA starter on this roster (Bargs). We don't know who the 2012 pick is and JV hasn't played a game. Should the focus of this team really be shifting to the playoffs at this stage? Isn't this wildly premature? Isn't this exactly what happened in 2006? Why the rush to repeat a process that's a proven failure?
                    i think you're being too pessimistic here. bargs is definitely a starter in this league. 28 other teams would love bargs on their rosters.

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                    • #25
                      Matt52 wrote: View Post
                      Casey might be speaking from a future perspective. He may have an idea of what types of players or transactions are on the horizon. I fully expect come training camp the roster to be much different than it is today.

                      The role players are in place (ED, AMIR, DD, JJ, LK, JC, maybe Aaron Gray)
                      The fringe players don't matter (Uzoh, Alabi, Anderson, Forbes, Magloire)
                      2 pillars are in place (AB and JV).

                      What gets added this summer through draft, free agency, or trade is to be determined.


                      Regardless of what pieces are added, there has been a shift in philosophy and expectation in the franchise. Is the house finished? Not yet but the most important part of the house is definitely done: the foundation.
                      I feel it's too soon to call JV a pillar. Seeing he hasn't played one NBA game. His probably is untouchable but pillar that's a lil too much.
                      @Chr1st1anL

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                      • #26
                        Chr1s1anL wrote: View Post
                        I feel it's too soon to call JV a pillar. Seeing he hasn't played one NBA game. His probably is untouchable but pillar that's a lil too much.
                        Fair enough.

                        But if he was in this draft he'd be going 2 and if this was last year's draft again, he'd be going 2.

                        You don't draft a guy #2 (or #5) not thinking he will be a pillar.

                        He hasn't proved d!ck yet so in theory I agree with what you are saying. But every struggling and rebuilding franchise is looking at a high lotto pick as something to build on or with.

                        I can't wait for next season.

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                        • #27
                          Matt52 wrote: View Post
                          ...I can't wait for next season.
                          Or even this coming off-season :-)

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                          • #28
                            Out of, Bayless, Alabi, Uzoh, Anderson, Magloire, Gray, (Weems). Which ones do you re-sign which ones do you replace in free agency? Right away Our two first round picks replace two of these players. What happens to the rest?

                            I would replace Weems and Anderson not sure about the rest yet...
                            -"You can’t run from me. I mean, my heart don’t bleed Kool-Aid."
                            -"“I ain’t no diva! I don’t have no blond hair, red hair. I’m Reggie Evans.”

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                            • #29
                              I am not a good proponent of beating the playoffs drum this early, especially when even a single move hasn't yet been made to improve the roster.
                              Granted, JV is coming over, but my expectations of him in the first season is putting up Amir-like numbers, around 9ppg and 7rpg and being slightly better than Ed Davis. That's all. IMO He'll need at least 2 but most likely 3 seasons before he takes his leap. More importantly, let's see how the cap space is used in a not-so-rich FA coming up and who we draft and get an idea of the future roster at least on paper.
                              Last edited by playmak3r5; Thu Apr 26, 2012, 11:02 PM.

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                              • #30
                                Raptorsss wrote: View Post
                                Out of, Bayless, Alabi, Uzoh, Anderson, Magloire, Gray, (Weems). Which ones do you re-sign which ones do you replace in free agency? Right away Our two first round picks replace two of these players. What happens to the rest?

                                I would replace Weems and Anderson not sure about the rest yet...
                                We keep Anderson, Gray, and likely Magloire. Everyone else goes.

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