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Bosh: "We're just not a good team."

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  • #16
    You forgot the 4th point, replace the coach. It is a simple move that can quickly decide if the problem is coaching.

    What is the point of a trade if coaching is the real crux of the problem?

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    • #17
      CripwalkinK wrote: View Post
      If BC wants to keep Bosh, he's gonna have to execute a trade, even if it means getting rid of Calderon, Turkoglu or Bargnani or anyone else on the squad.
      All 3 in a heart beat, lol

      However I'm starting to think that they don't want Bosh around so this is how they do it.

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      • #18
        trizzo wrote: View Post
        You forgot the 4th point, replace the coach. It is a simple move that can quickly decide if the problem is coaching.

        What is the point of a trade if coaching is the real crux of the problem?
        but coaching isn't the REAL crux of the problem...the guy who hired the coach...the guy who acquired the players...isn't that the crux of the problem? i mean, why would anyone trust that any moves BC makes at this point will actually help the team. for someone who's essentially been given carte blanche to do what he pleases (aside from going into the tax), you'd have to admit that the on-court product hasn't quite lived up to his hype. look, i've been a raptor fan (read: apologist) for as long as i can remember, and i know that things CAN change. but when you step back & examine the big picture over the last couple years, it's not like things have been trending upwards. it's like a massive headwound is being covered with some gauze & duct tape, with the expectation being that everything is just a-ok.

        and why does it feel like last year all over again? weren't these things (defense, effort, rebounding, hustle, defense, effort, effort, gameplan, effort, cohesion, effort, defense) the same things that were blatantly lacking last year? jeebus, at least do a different kind of pissy job putting a team together...
        TRUE LOVE - Sometimes you know it the instant you see it across the bar.

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        • #19
          Absolutely agree, Yertu.

          This team has been on downward spiral for years now. Different players, different coaches, worse results. Only one thing hasn't changed and it's time to change it.

          Colangelo has brought NOTHING to this franchise except headaches and little wiggle room. Surrounding 3-4 good players with players that are 8-9 players deep on a good team just doesn't work. Sure, you can get lucky and have the chemistry work, but Reggie Evans won't be riding on a white horse when he comes back.

          The challenge should be put on the coaching staff to come up with new schemes using the players we have. If they can't produce, then Jay should be let go.....but only after Colangelo is shown the door.

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          • #20
            AltRaps wrote: View Post
            The challenge should be put on the coaching staff to come up with new schemes using the players we have. If they can't produce, then Jay should be let go.....but only after Colangelo is shown the door.
            Full-fledge zone defense. Live or die by it. We can't stop anybody man-to-man and we're too slow to defend. Problem with zone though is that rebounding becomes more complicated which is something else we suck at.

            I don't see any answers other than the Raptors playing 100% harder in every aspect of the game.

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            • #21
              When we played zone last night, the outside shots just killed us. Of course, everything the Hawks put up barely even touched rim, but this goes back to our discussion on the podcast about the quickness/smarts of our players on the defensive end. If it isn't there, it isn't there.

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              • #22
                i've said it before - zone press; start amir, start jack, maybe even belli, & press the bejeezus out of the opponent for the first few minutes of the game; if it works, you steal some easy buckets, tire out &/or frustrate their starters - if it doesn't...well, you're pretty much where you'd be anyway. at least this way, you take advantage of whetever 'strengths' this team has (deep bench? ok, i'm grasping...). have bosh reprise his olympics role. bring in your offensive-oriented guys (jose, bargs) relatively early to play either against tiring starters or bench guys. rinse & repeat.

                i mean, seriously, at this point, what's to lose?

                nothing beats spending an hour with the trade machine following a loss like this. of course, i'm not looking to make the team better, just fucking around. i figured that since they play like the wash. generals, they might as well look like the wash. generals. came up with a nice little 4-team deal that netted the raps marc gasol, darko, galinari, haddadi, jaric & deiner. only had to give up bosh, banks, amir, sonny, wright & po'b. seems like something that might interest the BMOC...
                TRUE LOVE - Sometimes you know it the instant you see it across the bar.

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                • #23
                  yertu damkule wrote: View Post
                  nothing beats spending an hour with the trade machine following a loss like this. of course, i'm not looking to make the team better, just fucking around. i figured that since they play like the wash. generals, they might as well look like the wash. generals. came up with a nice little 4-team deal that netted the raps marc gasol, darko, galinari, haddadi, jaric & deiner. only had to give up bosh, banks, amir, sonny, wright & po'b. seems like something that might interest the BMOC...
                  So you want this team to go more international than we already are?

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                  • #24
                    i played last night, and one of the guys who plays with us is a chucker in the ultimate sense of the word. i decided to track his touches:shots ratio. at one point, it was 23:25 (23 shots on 25 touches - i shit you not). i lost track after that.

                    reason i bring it up is that he doesn't defend a lick, doesn't rebound, and i've seen him literally run away from loose balls (not that he's afraid to mix it up, he just wants someone else to do the dirty work, and then pass it to him). he's the last guy back on D, he's the first guy to leak out...just a total pain in the ass to play with. the worst of it - he actually makes his shots, so he just keeps on firing away. to sum up - a fucking horrible teammate.

                    not that i'm trying to make comparisons with any raptors or anything. i just felt like bitching about something other than the raps.
                    TRUE LOVE - Sometimes you know it the instant you see it across the bar.

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                    • #25
                      haha...no, of course not. i just think BC has this fascination with revolutionizing the NBA, and nothing is gonna get him off that ideology. the big fear i have is that he's more interested in establishing his name than building a chip team...y'know, becoming a guy 'known' for something unique.

                      i'm not the type of guy who's gonna malign a player for where he's from; there are plenty of good, tough, sound fundamental international players. we just don't happen to have many (any?) of 'em on this roster.
                      TRUE LOVE - Sometimes you know it the instant you see it across the bar.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        yertu damkule wrote: View Post
                        i played last night, and one of the guys who plays with us is a chucker in the ultimate sense of the word. i decided to track his touches:shots ratio. at one point, it was 23:25 (23 shots on 25 touches - i shit you not). i lost track after that.

                        reason i bring it up is that he doesn't defend a lick, doesn't rebound, and i've seen him literally run away from loose balls (not that he's afraid to mix it up, he just wants someone else to do the dirty work, and then pass it to him). he's the last guy back on D, he's the first guy to leak out...just a total pain in the ass to play with. the worst of it - he actually makes his shots, so he just keeps on firing away. to sum up - a fucking horrible teammate.

                        not that i'm trying to make comparisons with any raptors or anything. i just felt like bitching about something other than the raps.
                        LOL .... I think every small town has one of those guys. God knows I've run into a bunch of them over the years. But if we were comparing him to current Raptors, he sounds like Turkoglu only your peer can hit his shots at least.

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                        • #27
                          yertu damkule wrote: View Post
                          i played last night, and one of the guys who plays with us is a chucker in the ultimate sense of the word. i decided to track his touches:shots ratio. at one point, it was 23:25 (23 shots on 25 touches - i shit you not). i lost track after that.

                          reason i bring it up is that he doesn't defend a lick, doesn't rebound, and i've seen him literally run away from loose balls (not that he's afraid to mix it up, he just wants someone else to do the dirty work, and then pass it to him). he's the last guy back on D, he's the first guy to leak out...just a total pain in the ass to play with. the worst of it - he actually makes his shots, so he just keeps on firing away. to sum up - a fucking horrible teammate.

                          not that i'm trying to make comparisons with any raptors or anything. i just felt like bitching about something other than the raps.

                          Is he a Filipino guy that wears a Pistons' Grant Hill jersey? If so, he plays with me too. I hear what you're saying, those are the worst kinds of players.

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                          • #28
                            yertu damkule wrote: View Post
                            haha...no, of course not. i just think BC has this fascination with revolutionizing the NBA, and nothing is gonna get him off that ideology. the big fear i have is that he's more interested in establishing his name than building a chip team...y'know, becoming a guy 'known' for something unique.

                            i'm not the type of guy who's gonna malign a player for where he's from; there are plenty of good, tough, sound fundamental international players. we just don't happen to have many (any?) of 'em on this roster.
                            It's a team like we have right now when I wish Garbo was still healthy and around. Its that type of toughness we lack. And I'm sorry, if there are fans out there that think Evans is going to turn this team around with his court presence and toughness, then we have bigger problems. This is a team effort, not something one player can singlehandly fix.

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                            • #29
                              Arsenalist wrote: View Post
                              Is he a Filipino guy that wears a Pistons' Grant Hill jersey? If so, he plays with me too. I hear what you're saying, those are the worst kinds of players.
                              no man, i'm in halifax. though i went to school in guelph, and used to play pick-up; there was a filipino guy who played who totally LOOKED like a baller, and he sure did like to fire up shots.

                              there's a good comment in the roll call by 'hateslosing,' in which he/she interprets bargs' lack of touches to be in-house punishment by the players, because they feel the coaching staff isn't making bargs accountable for his D or rebounding (or, in general, sustained effort/hustle). only problem i have with that theory is that it seems jose is the one who looks him off, and he (jose) is the last dude on the planet to be punishing someone else for their defensive short-comings.

                              all-in-all...i'm gonna enjoy this. for so many years, the raps have lacked an identity we could be proud of. soft was one. euro-centric another. middling. now, they're shitty, on a clippers/timberwolves kinda level. now THAT is something worth being proud of.
                              TRUE LOVE - Sometimes you know it the instant you see it across the bar.

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                              • #30
                                I didn't realize Yertu was a fellow Haligonian.

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