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Raptors starting 5 among the top 5 in the league

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  • #16
    Is this actually new information?? Didn't we already know that our starting line-up was top 5 like 2 months ago!? This is what a LOT of Anti-Tankers were saying for sooooo long. Let these guys play and see what they can do. I'm glad some posters are finally paying attention.... geeesh. lol

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    • #17
      Take Toronto's starters. toss out the stats and just pretend were talking ball here.

      Name one of the final 8 teams last year, who you believe Toronto's starting five, could beat down the stretch 10 mins of a tied game at a .650 rate or so. You name one and I bet you're dreaming. Toronto, like many shitter teams have numbers that aren't quite adjusted properly, they play in way less big time moments, they play a lot of meaningless minutes. Numbers only tell a statistical account of what happened, they don't tell you how a game wa splayed, what the circumstances were etc.

      Toronto, is not anywhere close to an elite team, not even remotely close. They are my team, I will cheer for um, but they are sad still.

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      • #18
        Craig wrote: View Post
        Take Toronto's starters. toss out the stats and just pretend were talking ball here.

        Name one of the final 8 teams last year, who you believe Toronto's starting five, could beat down the stretch 10 mins of a tied game at a .650 rate or so. You name one and I bet you're dreaming. Toronto, like many shitter teams have numbers that aren't quite adjusted properly, they play in way less big time moments, they play a lot of meaningless minutes. Numbers only tell a statistical account of what happened, they don't tell you how a game wa splayed, what the circumstances were etc.

        Toronto, is not anywhere close to an elite team, not even remotely close. They are my team, I will cheer for um, but they are sad still.
        I don't care about the offense but they have the potential to be an elite Defensive team. That's all it takes in the league. Look at Memphis could you really say that's a extremely talent team? They guard every position(well at least when Hollins was there)
        @Chr1st1anL

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        • #19
          I like that, I likke they can guard, and I hope they can be elite one day. But in crunch time, they have never shown they can shut down other good teams, nor that they could execute against them. Playing meaningless games when your eliminated in february, or in pre season is not the same as playing big games in May.

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          • #20
            Craig wrote: View Post
            Take Toronto's starters. toss out the stats and just pretend were talking ball here.

            Name one of the final 8 teams last year, who you believe Toronto's starting five, could beat down the stretch 10 mins of a tied game at a .650 rate or so. You name one and I bet you're dreaming. Toronto, like many shitter teams have numbers that aren't quite adjusted properly, they play in way less big time moments, they play a lot of meaningless minutes. Numbers only tell a statistical account of what happened, they don't tell you how a game wa splayed, what the circumstances were etc.

            Toronto, is not anywhere close to an elite team, not even remotely close. They are my team, I will cheer for um, but they are sad still.
            You do realize we're talking about the STARTING FIVE (Lowry, Derozan, Gay, JV, Amir)....Everyone and their grandparents knew the Raptor's bench sucked last year!

            Also, i think its time for posters to get over the PAST. This team is definitely better than it was last year. Demar seems better, Fields seems better, Rudy seems better, Lowry seems better and JV is definitely better (just based on growth alone). We got rid of Bargnani and replaced him with Novak and Hansborough (BETTER no?) DJ is probably better BUT no worse than JL3......To all the negative people out there - Please give this team at least a few weeks before you start shitting on our players!!!

            Thanks!

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            • #21
              WTF?

              You can only go off what has been seen and done bud, you wanna base your opinions on what could be, thats cool, I like an optimist, its all good.

              I'm just telling you how it is. This team, is getting better, but there is a really big gap between true contenders and pretenders. Part of that is learning to play when it actually matters.

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              • #22
                Craig wrote: View Post
                I like that, I likke they can guard, and I hope they can be elite one day. But in crunch time, they have never shown they can shut down other good teams, nor that they could execute against them. Playing meaningless games when your eliminated in february, or in pre season is not the same as playing big games in May.
                Games in February are never meaningless? This isn't the same team we started with last season. That team could not close out games.
                @Chr1st1anL

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                • #23
                  We shall see my friend. I'm not getting my hopes up.

                  I welcome success, but will be happy with failure.

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                  • #24
                    Nilanka wrote: View Post
                    Agreed on the bench not being as terrible as they're made out to be.

                    And agreed on Casey using his bench to compliment his starters. There should never be more than 3 bench guys on the floor together....ever (something else Jack Armstrong eluded to).
                    One option is to have a quick hook with Rudy or Demar. Haven't thought it all the way through but if you pull Demar with say, 5:00 left in the 1Q, then you bring him back for the entire second quarter. Roll Rudy for the entire first and give him 5 or 6 off in the second, then you always have one of them out there. You could also, theoretically, run a similar set up with Amir and Val, though it's more complicated given you're looking at them both playing about 30 mins.

                    My only real concern with the bench is the PG spot. Not sure you can manipulate that much.

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                    • #25
                      slaw wrote: View Post
                      One option is to have a quick hook with Rudy or Demar. Haven't thought it all the way through but if you pull Demar with say, 5:00 left in the 1Q, then you bring him back for the entire second quarter. Roll Rudy for the entire first and give him 5 or 6 off in the second, then you always have one of them out there. You could also, theoretically, run a similar set up with Amir and Val, though it's more complicated given you're looking at them both playing about 30 mins.

                      My only real concern with the bench is the PG spot. Not sure you can manipulate that much.
                      I yelled that sort of stuff at my tv all of last season, wondering why DC changed his lineup like a hockey team rolling out their second line. I drool at the prospect of a coach actually using a rotation, and not just 5-man lines. I think Gay/DeRozan and maybe Fields will always be on when the backup PG is running the show, to ensure there are other adequate ball handlers on the court. If the pressure to be a floor general can be relieved, allowing the backup PG to focus more on defense, they'll be set (which also sets up nicely for a guy like Stone).

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                      • #26
                        Craig wrote: View Post
                        WTF?

                        You can only go off what has been seen and done bud, you wanna base your opinions on what could be, thats cool, I like an optimist, its all good.

                        I'm just telling you how it is. This team, is getting better, but there is a really big gap between true contenders and pretenders. Part of that is learning to play when it actually matters.
                        And you can't learn to play like that without, you know, actually playing together. For the most part the final 8 teams you mentioned all had a pretty high degree of continuity, coaches included.

                        That's something the Raptors are beginning this year, but who knows if it will be allowed to continue. Or if they have the overall talent to truly take advantage of it.
                        Two beer away from being two beers away.

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                        • #27
                          Mess wrote: View Post
                          And you can't learn to play like that without, you know, actually playing together. For the most part the final 8 teams you mentioned all had a pretty high degree of continuity, coaches included.

                          That's something the Raptors are beginning this year, but who knows if it will be allowed to continue. Or if they have the overall talent to truly take advantage of it.
                          Agreed, in that experience and repetition of an in place system is needed to get to that next level. 100%. Which, is why I stand by my opinion here because Toronto has far from accomplished that task. They need to do it this year with a solid core of the young players playing "learning minutes", and they need, as much as people hate to hear, to lose, a lot.

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                          • #28
                            special1 wrote: View Post
                            You do realize we're talking about the STARTING FIVE (Lowry, Derozan, Gay, JV, Amir)....Everyone and their grandparents knew the Raptor's bench sucked last year!

                            Also, i think its time for posters to get over the PAST. This team is definitely better than it was last year. Demar seems better, Fields seems better, Rudy seems better, Lowry seems better and JV is definitely better (just based on growth alone). We got rid of Bargnani and replaced him with Novak and Hansborough (BETTER no?) DJ is probably better BUT no worse than JL3......To all the negative people out there - Please give this team at least a few weeks before you start shitting on our players!!!

                            Thanks!
                            Time will tell. Hope we have better start than last year.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Craig wrote: View Post
                              WTF?

                              You can only go off what has been seen and done bud, you wanna base your opinions on what could be, thats cool, I like an optimist, its all good.

                              I'm just telling you how it is. This team, is getting better, but there is a really big gap between true contenders and pretenders. Part of that is learning to play when it actually matters.
                              I don't think anybody has come close to proposing that they're "true contenders" at this point. Teams don't go from 9th in the East to contenders in 1 season, not even if you have a Lebron or KD. What some of us are looking at is 1 step, then another, then another. In 2010, Pacers had 32 wins and out of the playoffs for the 4th straight year. 2011 saw 37 wins, and 1st round exit. 2012 saw 42 wins and 2nd round exit. Looking like the proverbial treadmill team, hey. Then in 2013, 49 wins and pushing Miami to 7 games in East Finals. All with only 1 lottery pick, George at 10th)

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                              • #30
                                p00ka wrote: View Post
                                I don't think anybody has come close to proposing that they're "true contenders" at this point. Teams don't go from 9th in the East to contenders in 1 season, not even if you have a Lebron or KD. What some of us are looking at is 1 step, then another, then another. In 2010, Pacers had 32 wins and out of the playoffs for the 4th straight year. 2011 saw 37 wins, and 1st round exit. 2012 saw 42 wins and 2nd round exit. Looking like the proverbial treadmill team, hey. Then in 2013, 49 wins and pushing Miami to 7 games in East Finals. All with only 1 lottery pick, George at 10th)
                                Difference between Indiana and Toronto is cap space.

                                Indiana were able to keep their core and add David west.

                                Only way toronto adds a David west is if Rudy Gay is gone.

                                I think we can all agree that if you take Rudy gay off this team it won't be pretty.

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