Is There A Scenario -- Loul Deng edition

[Miekenstien]

Plain and simple, I want someone younger and cheaper going forward. Draft pick preferably. I don't necessarily think this team will improve on the Win total next year, +-48 give or take 3 either way.

disagree. i think that jonas and ross but especially jonas will take us further next year. i also think that 10 mill a year for demar as an exceptional use of cap space.

[Miekenstien]

Instead of attacking Fox Machine about Deng being worse than DD. Argue from a standpoint that Deng has flaws X, Y, and Z that would make him not a good choice for the Raptors.

but what if those flaws no longer appear when he is on the raptors? we would never be able to prove them. all the evidence that has been put forth about demar is already being dismissed.

[Mack North]

disagree. i think that jonas and ross but especially jonas will take us further next year. i also think that 10 mill a year for demar as an exceptional use of cap space.

Sorry, I was referring to the thread title. I don't want Deng at his age/price on this team. I'd rather ride young players.

[mcHAPPY]

So players on the stretch can sign with another team. Didn't Quinten Richardson have to return to NY to sign a stretch contract for an extra 1 million so they could sign Amare

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No, he returned to sign a contract.

It was 3 years with year 2 and 3 unguaranteed.

The reason why it was done was because the money exchanged rules required in trades were not met. New York signed and traded him because he was on their roster previous season.

Q-Rich's agent basically received a call like this:

NY GM: We have no interest signing your client. However we want to complete a trade and we can't do it without him signed to a minimum contract and then traded. The other team is Toronto. They have no interest either. Essentially we'll give Q $1.3M to make this trade happen.

Q's Agent: I'll check with my client....... Q what you think?

Q:

GOD is so AWESOME!!!

— Quentin Richardson (@QRich) July 1, 2013

[mcHAPPY]

He was used as an example of a difficult to move contract and using the stretch. Contract prior to 2011 need mutual consent After 2011 basically a waiver.

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I think you are confusing sign and trade.

Stretch and trade have no impact on one another.


He was acquired by New Jersey/Brooklyn via trade with Dallas.
Resigned as free agent with NJ on one year deal after lock out in 2011.
Resigned as a free agent with NJ/Brooklyn on two year deal in 2012.
Traded to Boston in 2013 with one year left on his contract.
He is now an unrestricted free agent.


The player with contract hijinks to make Boston-Brooklyn (i..e PP and KG) trade work was Keith Bogans. But even that was a simple sign and trade - just like Q-Rich - except he received $5.8M this year. He is a scrub who truly hit the jack pot - right place, right time.

[DanH]

I think they'd have about 24 mil for these two.

Nah, roster slot holds and draft picks eat into that a bit. About 20M is kind of best case scenario.

[BobLoblaw]

Nah, roster slot holds and draft picks eat into that a bit. About 20M is kind of best case scenario.

Are you accounting for cap increase? Non-guaranteed portion of Salmons, Hansbrough deals?

[imanshumpert]

Stop

I'm not suggesting this here, I am just saying that how do you know PLAYER XXXXXXXX (ie doesn't matter) will be good/bad in a Raptors uniform?

You can have best guess is all

Instead of attacking Fox Machine about Deng being worse than DD. Argue from a standpoint that Deng has flaws X, Y, and Z that would make him not a good choice for the Raptors.

Yeah we can sit here and pretend that Deng would be a better fit on the Raptors than DD.

But let's go with what we KNOW and use that to evaluate.

DD is a better, younger player on a better contract. Trading him for Deng would be stupid to say the least and mortgaging DeRozan's value.

Don't tell me to "stop" clown

[Joey]

Stretch provision doesn't have to be accepted by players.

Do you mean in the CBA? Or if Management were to choose to use the "Stretch Provision" on them? Because they have no say on whether they get cut; which is exactly what using the stretch is. It's no different then being Cut/Waived, only the cap-hit is 'stretched' over a longer period of time.

[Miekenstien]

Don't tell me to "stop" clown

hahahahhahaaha.

[DanH]

Are you accounting for cap increase? Non-guaranteed portion of Salmons, Hansbrough deals?

Yes for Salmons and cap increase. Hansbrough being cut clears just under 2M, but he's worth more via trade I think.

[DanH]

Yes for Salmons and cap increase. Hansbrough being cut clears just under 2M, but he's worth more via trade I think.

Mind you, now I think of it, you could probably sign Deng first, then use Bird Rights to exceed the cap for Lowry, bringing the total available money closer to what you were saying.

[OldSkoolCool]

but what if those flaws no longer appear when he is on the raptors? we would never be able to prove them. all the evidence that has been put forth about demar is already being dismissed.

I think the flaws are fairly predictable.

For example, I don't expect Deng to randomly become a very good 3 point shooter if he were to come to the Raptors. One of the main reasons to replace DD would be to bring in 3 point shooting, so Deng would not be the best idea...

Yeah we can sit here and pretend that Deng would be a better fit on the Raptors than DD.

But let's go with what we KNOW and use that to evaluate.

DD is a better, younger player on a better contract. Trading him for Deng would be stupid to say the least and mortgaging DeRozan's value.

Don't tell me to "stop" clown

I'm not supporting the Deng trade (stated multiple times). You really lack reading comprehension. Your only argument is to attack other people by backhanded;y calling them stupid by things they have suggested, even if those ideas aren't stupid (only to you)

So please stop, you "clown"

[BigCamB]

[BobLoblaw]

Yes for Salmons and cap increase. Hansbrough being cut clears just under 2M, but he's worth more via trade I think.

I doubt that Hansbrough is worth much in a trade. He's a decent bench big. He's ok for his price but there's nothing special about him. There was a rumor that Indiana tried to give Hansbrough to Charlotte in a DJ Augustin sign and trade, and Charlotte didn't want him (for free essentially, since they let Augustin go anyway). I wonder who would offer more in a trade for him, a team that wants a backup 4 or a team that just wants to cut him and save the 2 mil.

Re salaries, I might be missing someone or something then, I guess. Here's what I see:
DeMar - 9.5
Amir - 7
Novak - 3.5
Jonas - 3.7
Ross - 2.8
Stretched players in that scenario: Fields - 2.1, Hayes - 2
Other payments: Salmons - 1, Hansbrough - 1, Camby - 0.7
1st pick - 1.2
5 roster cap holds - 2.5
In total 37 mil, with cap likely close to 63 mil.