Casey: I think DeMar DeRozan can become that superstar

[Axel]

You should probably let go of this obvious irrational hate of Demar's game. If you want the team to tank, that's fine. BUT don't pretend like you want us to start winning all of a sudden. BTW - check out my avatar.....what do you think? Is that going up strong and looking to finish or what??

Since when is wanting a player to make the smart play irrational? Demar's non-calls were widely discussed last season, with the popular theme being, Demar looks for the foul to bail him out instead of simply trying to finish through the contact. That is basketball 101. So how is that hate, or irrational?

As for the 2nd part, I'm sorry but that is just stupid. I'm not allowed to want the Raptors players to improve or play well? I'm not allowed to ask a player to perform to the best of their abilities? I don't think Demar finishing at the rim better will make any significant difference to the W/L anyways. Or are only the people who agree with your opinions real Raptors fans? If you ever actually bothered to read the posts, you'd see that I'm ok keeping Demar; trading Gay is my only real demand. So yes, I'd like to see Demar improve, as I do with all the Raptors players.

As for your avatar, one play does not make a player. I saw Walter Herrmann finish an alley-oop dunk on the Raps a few years ago, does that make him an elite dunker? Hells no. Demar has to show that he can consistently finish through the contact and not try to flail his arms then yell at the ref, which is basically his rep.

[blackjitsu]

This is an awful argument. It's like saying don't let your kid attempt a handstand unless he knows how to do a handstand. They gotta learn sometime and they're better off learning on soft sand (Game 1 vs the Celtics) than on concrete (playoff game vs the Heat).

#1 not an awful argument. This is the first game of the season. If you were coaching kids and it was the first game of the season, and only one player had the tools to do something without some advice you would let them play? Again -- know your personnel.

This isn't mid-season. This is the FIRST GAME OF THE SEASON. Crushing the opponent would have been a more positive learning experience.

The soft sand theory is nonsense. We could go into education theory -- but every theory that supports your idea is tied back to a teacher who can right the ship (Not Casey). Calling time out is exactly what a good (without those rare skills) teacher would do. Give the players the time to talk it out and the space for them to work it out. Letting them play on doesn't allow the students enough time to break down what they're seeing as a team (Without guidance it actually encourages the players to act as individuals).

THEN after they have had games where they have talked it out together multiple times you stop calling time outs. Lessons have to be learned before students can act independently.

Could the students learn on their own? Sure, but in a league where wins matter timeouts work faster. Did the students learn? No. eventually Casey subbed out the struggling players and NOTHING was learned. In fact, the opportunity to educate was completely LOST.

Please do not use statistic anomalies and an outlier like Phil to argue points that contradict the majority of solid coaching and call it a solid argument. There are far more Chuck Daly's, Rudy Tomjanovich's, etc., The only coach to follow your theory at the University level was the GREATEST OF ALL TIME!

For the record, the rare genius who has the ability to communicate their ideas has a far deeper chest to educate than the rest of us and Dwayne Casey is no genius. Phil was a genius who had Jordan, Pippen, Rodman, Kukoc, Kobe, Shaq, Gasol, etc., to lean on. Again, vets. Again, know your personnel.

[special1]

Since when is wanting a player to make the smart play irrational? Demar's non-calls were widely discussed last season, with the popular theme being, Demar looks for the foul to bail him out instead of simply trying to finish through the contact. That is basketball 101. So how is that hate, or irrational?

As for the 2nd part, I'm sorry but that is just stupid. I'm not allowed to want the Raptors players to improve or play well? I'm not allowed to ask a player to perform to the best of their abilities? I don't think Demar finishing at the rim better will make any significant difference to the W/L anyways. Or are only the people who agree with your opinions real Raptors fans? If you ever actually bothered to read the posts, you'd see that I'm ok keeping Demar; trading Gay is my only real demand. So yes, I'd like to see Demar improve, as I do with all the Raptors players.

As for your avatar, one play does not make a player. I saw Walter Herrmann finish an alley-oop dunk on the Raps a few years ago, does that make him an elite dunker? Hells no. Demar has to show that he can consistently finish through the contact and not try to flail his arms then yell at the ref, which is basically his rep.

Who?? LOL Dude are you now comparing Demar's finishing at the rim to this no name scrub? The hate continues...... Personally, I think Demar has shown that he has improved and can now finish through contact on a consistent basis. To continue to say he hasn't improved is either willful blindness, ignorance or hating.

FYI - Demar IS is an elite dunker! How can you even question this??? Have you seen the two dunk contests he competed in? NO PROPS NEEDED. You can't be serious!

[JimiCliff]

He has that ability and it's just a matter of time.

Apparently James Dolan has told his Knicks executives and coaches that he fully expects this year's team to contend for the championship. I see this statement to be on equal footing as Casey's statement above, and I can see two possible thought processes behind them:

1) Intentionally setting the bar too high, to try and inspire performance.

2) Utter, complete delusion.

[Axel]

Who?? LOL Dude are you now comparing Demar's finishing at the rim to this no name scrub? The hate continues...... Personally, I think Demar has shown that he has improved and can now finish through contact on a consistent basis. To continue to say he hasn't improved is either willful blindness, ignorance or hating.

FYI - Demar IS is an elite dunker! How can you even question this??? Have you seen the two dunk contests he competed in? NO PROPS NEEDED. You can't be serious!

Anyone who uses Dunk contest performances as a basis of real value, automatically invalidates everything they say.

You are trying to use a single avatar picture as an example of Demar's real actions. I found an equally ridiculous single time entity for comparison.

Demar hasn't shown he will finish with contact. He did it during the preseason, but his career thus far has been: spectacular dunk when open, badly missed with contact because he was looking for the foul call to bail him out when he left his feet. Don't confused, dunking ability (elite dunker) is not the same thing as finishing ability. I couldn't care less if he dunks it or puts it off the glass, either way, he needs to go up strong and finish through the contact. Until he does that consistently, he should be reminded of it every time he touches the ball.

[special1]

Apparently James Dolan has told his Knicks executives and coaches that he fully expects this year's team to contend for the championship. I see this statement to be on equal footing as Casey's statement above, and I can see two possible thought processes behind them:

1) Intentionally setting the bar too high, to try and inspire performance.

2) Utter, complete delusion.

Interesting..... I see Casey's statement as your option# 1. Intentionally setting the bar high to try to inspire performance. Notice i left out the *too*

I see your James Dolan example as your option# 2. Utter, complete delusion. Especially now that our former player in Andrea Bargnani is now a big part of their team. lol

[Axel]

Who?? LOL Dude are you now comparing Demar's finishing at the rim to this no name scrub? The hate continues...... Personally, I think Demar has shown that he has improved and can now finish through contact on a consistent basis. To continue to say he hasn't improved is either willful blindness, ignorance or hating.

FYI - Demar IS is an elite dunker! How can you even question this??? Have you seen the two dunk contests he competed in? NO PROPS NEEDED. You can't be serious!

Oh, in case you were wondering, Walter Herrman made 2nd Team NBA All-Rookie, know who didn't? Demar

[special1]

Anyone who uses Dunk contest performances as a basis of real value, automatically invalidates everything they say.
You are trying to use a single avatar picture as an example of Demar's real actions. I found an equally ridiculous single time entity for comparison.

Demar hasn't shown he will finish with contact. He did it during the preseason, but his career thus far has been: spectacular dunk when open, badly missed with contact because he was looking for the foul call to bail him out when he left his feet. Don't confused, dunking ability (elite dunker) is not the same thing as finishing ability. I couldn't care less if he dunks it or puts it off the glass, either way, he needs to go up strong and finish through the contact. Until he does that consistently, he should be reminded of it every time he touches the ball.

First bold - You brought up the argument about being an elite dunker! If we are talking about dunking, shouldn't a dunk contest have some value??

Second bold - Who is the consistency judge? You? LOL Your joking right? Are you trying to be troll? You realize that Demar was top 20 in the ENTIRE league in free throw attempts per game right? Is that not consistency?? Demar was also top 12 in free throws made per game.

http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/pl...Made/year/2013

Furthermore, he was tied for 7th in the ENTIRE NBA (with Dwight Howard) for total free throws made last season. How come you never say the good things about his game??

You need to quit pushing your agenda. Your the one bringing consistent negative opinions to this thread. Demar still has room for growth and is still improving on finishing through contact. Your point is moot.

[special1]

Oh, in case you were wondering, Walter Herrman made 2nd Team NBA All-Rookie, know who didn't? Demar

In case you forgot, Demar is still in the league (with a brand new 9.5 million dollar contract for 4 years)..... Guess who isn't?? Your 2nd team nba all-rookie scrub. Homer.

[Axel]

First bold - You brought up the argument about being an elite dunker! If we are talking about dunking, shouldn't a dunk contest have some value??

Second bold - Who is the consistency judge? You? LOL Your joking right? Are you trying to be troll? You realize that Demar was top 20 in the ENTIRE league in free throw attempts per game right? Is that not consistency?? Demar was also top 12 in free throws made per game.

Furthermore, he was tied for 7th in the ENTIRE NBA (with Dwight Howard) for total free throws made last season. How come you never say the good things about his game??

You need to quit pushing your agenda. Your the one bringing consistent negative opinions to this thread. Demar still has room for growth and is still improving on finishing through contact. Your point is moot.

Man, you still don't seem to read posts before you start arguing. At what point did I speak to Demar and dunking? The only time I used the work "dunk" was in reference to Walter Herrmann. All of my posts have been about Demar finishing through contact and to keep attacking the rim.

And no, dunk contest dunks are still completely irrelevant to dunking ability when you are talking about actual games.

You're right, Demar was 17th in FTA per game. But he also played a ton of minutes. If a guy plays twice the minutes, shouldn't he have twice the attempts? Where was Demar in FTA per 36 minutes? He actually dropped from 5.2 per game, to 5.1 per 36. His ranking drops down to 44th. Who's the "elite" at getting to the Free Throw line? Top 5 - Harden (9.6), Howard (9.5), Durant (8.7), Love (8.3) and Tyler Hansbrough (7.9). So technically, Demar isn't even the best at getting to the line on his own team. So when you talk about consistency, you need to take out the volume stats (per game) and look at per 36 because you need to gauge how often a player does something when presented the opportunity. If a player has higher opportunity, but doesn't have higher production to back it up, then that isn't consistent, regardless of what you think of my credibility.

I'm not saying Demar is bad at getting to the line, but his career thus far is to not finish through the contact, which has been my entire point, and he tends to shy away as the game goes on, which he did vs Boston.

Your last part is what makes you such a frustrating person to post with. You refuse to read anyone's post, but assume so much, then proceed to say that I shouldn't post and that my point is moot? How is moot? Because you disagree? lol. You question my credibility on factually based observations and push your own ignorant view because it is your belief. I have no problem with your beliefs, but don't tell me not to share mine.

In case you forgot, Demar is still in the league (with a brand new 9.5 million dollar contract for 4 years)..... Guess who isn't?? Your 2nd team nba all-rookie scrub. Homer.

How am I a Homer? But yes, the Herrmann post was a troll comment because you seem quite ignorant and I stopped giving a fuck. Herrmann looked like Thor, about as relevant to his awesomeness as Demar's Slam Dunk Performances to his game.

[Rapzilla]

What do you guys make of this?

[special1]

Man, you still don't seem to read posts before you start arguing. At what point did I speak to Demar and dunking? The only time I used the work "dunk" was in reference to Walter Herrmann. All of my posts have been about Demar finishing through contact and to keep attacking the rim.

And no, dunk contest dunks are still completely irrelevant to dunking ability when you are talking about actual games.

You're right, Demar was 17th in FTA per game. But he also played a ton of minutes. If a guy plays twice the minutes, shouldn't he have twice the attempts? Where was Demar in FTA per 36 minutes? He actually dropped from 5.2 per game, to 5.1 per 36. His ranking drops down to 44th. Who's the "elite" at getting to the Free Throw line? Top 5 - Harden (9.6), Howard (9.5), Durant (8.7), Love (8.3) and Tyler Hansbrough (7.9). So technically, Demar isn't even the best at getting to the line on his own team. So when you talk about consistency, you need to take out the volume stats (per game) and look at per 36 because you need to gauge how often a player does something when presented the opportunity. If a player has higher opportunity, but doesn't have higher production to back it up, then that isn't consistent, regardless of what you think of my credibility.

I'm not saying Demar is bad at getting to the line, but his career thus far is to not finish through the contact, which has been my entire point, and he tends to shy away as the game goes on, which he did vs Boston.

Your last part is what makes you such a frustrating person to post with. You refuse to read anyone's post, but assume so much, then proceed to say that I shouldn't post and that my point is moot? How is moot? Because you disagree? lol. You question my credibility on factually based observations and push your own ignorant view because it is your belief. I have no problem with your beliefs, but don't tell me not to share mine.



How am I a Homer? But yes, the Herrmann post was a troll comment because you seem quite ignorant and I stopped giving a fuck. Herrmann looked like Thor, about as relevant to his awesomeness as Demar's Slam Dunk Performances to his game.

I quote REAL stats (you know what Demar actually did) and you come back to me with PER 36??? LOL right......per 36 is estimated..... Real stats are real stats. Honestly, i dont even use per 36 stats because their often unrealistic. Demar was 7th in free throws made last year. THATS REAL.

[Axel]

I quote REAL stats (you know what Demar actually did) and you come back to me with PER 36??? LOL right......per 36 is estimated..... Real stats are real stats. Honestly, i dont even use per 36 stats because their often unrealistic. Demar was 7th in free throws made per game last year. THATS REAL.

hahahahahahahaha. Per 36 is estimated? I believe the word you are looking for is extrapolated and they are very real stats. They demonstrate how often a player performs an action relative to the opportunity given, so you can determine what is over-inflated by different minutes played and what is a consistent action perform when given an opportunity.

[mcHAPPY]

Wait, are you saying Boogie is worse than DeMar on Defense? (falls off chair). There's a reason why he's on all my fantasy teams. I think you're missing the big picture -- he alters shots, is good for 2 steals a game, excellent rebounder, gets a couple blocks a game... I suspect that you do not watch Boogie Cousins play...or look at his stats., or listen to the boat-load of analysts who praise the kid...



I explained this deeper into my quote -- look at the number of vets Phil had. Letting players play out of runs only works when the coach has vets to lean on. When that run happened the only vet capable of doing that was Rudy Gay. In fact, the only player on the Raps with enough in game experience to do that is Rudy -- and he does not run plays, can only make plays if the ball is given to him. Casey fails at the root of coaching #1: Know your personnel.



Well (hold your laughter for a sec), DeMar showed promise last year -- that would fit your trend. Also, I strongly disagree that DeMar has ever been showcased as "the man" on the Raps. That space has always been held by Bargnani. Last year was the first year that DeMar was more than a 3rd option on the Raps. Other than the trip to London, DeMar had never been higher than option 1 Bargs, option 2 name the PG of the day ... Heck Barbosa was higher up the totem pole... That's why when Bargs went down the Raps were always in disarray -- there were no plays designed for anyone else. Last year changed that. And DeMar did his highly inefficient thing. By the way, still more efficient than Bargs in the same role.

I'm not saying he will become a star, but I just don't think that it's an idea that shouldn't (edit) be scoffed or laughed at.

What did DD show last year other than being able to score points at an average rate? The players you gave were extremely efficient, multi-dimensional scorers and were multi-dimensional players. DD not so much..... yet. Comparing DD to Bargnani is never a good footing for a discussion.

[special1]

hahahahahahahaha. Per 36 is estimated? I believe the word you are looking for is extrapolated and they are very real stats. They demonstrate how often a player performs an action relative to the opportunity given, so you can determine what is over-inflated by different minutes played and what is a consistent action perform when given an opportunity.

Hahahaha. Your still bringing that ish? Fine EXTRAPOLATED but not as is. Your confusing what a player could've done (per 36) with what a player did do (actual stats). Further to your point - Tyler Hansborough won't play 36 mins per game because he's a BENCH player. Therefore, who cares how much he COULD get if he played 36 mins per game? See the difference in our points?? Mine is REAL and yours is estimated/inflated/extrapolated.