Here you go.


Off Ball Offense

Valanciunas’ biggest strength offensively is when he is working off of the basketball cutting and in pick and roll sets, and his international team, Lietuvos Rytas was smart enough to build Valanciunas’ offense around that, as 43.3% of his offense was either cuts or pick and rolls (if you want to add offensive rebounds, off ball offense makes up 65.1% of Valanciunas’ offense).

As the roll man in pick and roll sets (23.2% of all offensive possessions) Valanciunas posted a PPP of 1.434, which puts him in the top 4% of all international players as he shot 74.7%. Valanciunas rolled to the rim 97% of the time in pick and roll sets (slipping the screen the remaining 3%), showing his ability to find lanes when rolling to the rim, making the catch, and getting the ball on the rim:


He’s mortal.

Full Article Here.

Share this:
  • Riego

    Just one note people should know: Lithuania as a country is big on basketball, but their league’s level is very low. Almost all (if not all) of those vids were of regular lithuanian league’s games, in Euroleague (where L.Rytas is an average team) the last season was harder to see that JV.

    I don’t see he can’t be a really good player, just saying people should take some caution watching those vids. Not the same about Euroleague games, where the level of competition in much higher, and not so far from NBA.

    • Riego

      “I don’t say” not I don’t see…sorry for my english 😉

      • Malefax

        Still, that’s ok — any footage we’d have of 18 yr old american prospects would be from NCAA stuff where the level might not be very high either, and would certainly be less than euroleague.

        • Theswirsky

          “certainly be less than euroleague”


          • Jonny1122

            You really think NCAA is better than euroleague? Just because you know who they are and they are probably american doesn’t make them better. They are still amateurs. The top few teams like Kentucky or North Carolina might do alright in the Lithuanian league (though I really don’t know anything about the league) but the average team of the 300+ NCAA div 1 schools would get destroyed.

            Also, in the actual Euroleague (which are the best few teams from each countries league playing against each other) any single NCAA team no matter which one would get fucking demolished night in and night out. Even an NCAA all-star team would be handled with ease by a team like FC Barcelona or Real Madrid.

            • Riego

              Like FC Barcelona YES, like Real Madrid NOOOO (A Barça fan here 😀 )…And you are right, but my point was about the Lithuanian regular league. In that case, that league may be worse than NCAA, with only a couple of good teams. Comparing Euroleague with NCAA is non-sense. And I’ll go further, some NBA teams would be beaten easily by for example FC Barcelona.

              • Bendit

                Go on, say it…”like the Raptors”. 🙂

                • Riego

                  It’s sad, but I’m afraid that’s tue situation right now… 🙁

            • KJ-B

              Mean beat boys in most sports: PERIOD.

          • Ricky

            Jonathan Giovny of Draft Express said the Lithuanian team from the U-19 tournament would win the NCAA tournament if they were to play in it.

            • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

              First they would have to qualify as NCAA basketball players are also students that have to go to class not just play basketball.

              As well the NCAA is a long season plus the March Madness- anything can happen ie UConn winning the ‘ship.

              • Ihatehaters

                Not sure how many classes NCAA BBall “students” actually go to…

                • Bobbert

                  Enough to maintain a 2.0 gpa I believe or they are suspended. Either way classes would make almost no difference, the insane guy is just grabbing at straws.

                • Yeah but isn’t it true that things get bent until they’re almost broken…like say the rules…Basketball is big money for Universities.  

              • Veritas Vindice

                Have them boys from NCAA go to Euroleague. Why waste time pretending to learn chemistry and English lit when you can improve your fundamentals and set plays like them big white boys from Europe? And if anything can happen, yeah, you and I could win the ‘ship.

                • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

                  Because the NCAA makes money off of them by exploiting their athletic talents under the guise of being a student/athlete.

                  All Euros aren’t white guys ie Tony Parker- recognize.smdh

                  That being said your sarcasm is as fleeting as BC’s promises of AB being a 5 year project.

                • Veritas Vindice

                  Tony Parker is a brother with an accent. He ain’t no Euro.

                  And what’s with your lovefest with Bargnani? That no-defense-tool ain’t worth anyone’s time and yet you bring him up again and again. The only one who’s going to miss him when he gets dumped for a draft pick is you.

                • Nilanka15

                  Tony Parker isn’t a Euro?  What are you talking about? 

                  Parker was born in Belgium, and raised in France.  The last time I checked, both those countries are in Europe.

                • GM

                  Well according to him, you are considered a “Euro” if you’re white and have an accent lol..

                • Veritas Vindice

                  Damn straight that’s what I’m saying. The moment people start using a labelling term like “Euro”, they don’t mean someone with a European passport. Suk-bum Kim might be the next great pitcher, but even if he has a Swedish passport, few people will think he’s Swedish. Except for maybe GM and Nilanka — they’ll hold hands, sing Kumbaya and prostrate themselve before Suk-bum Kim’s “Euroness”. Even now, they’re bumping into each other like headless chickens, henceforth confused by Bismark Biyombo’s newfound “Euroness”.

                • Veritas Vindice

                  I meant Serge Ibaka of course.

                • GM

                  Dumb comparison, and you’re convergence of “suk” and “bum” are disturbing as well. 

                  Biyombo isn’t Euro, but hey, he looks a lot like 90% of the NBA, he’s black, maybe we should call him American? You know, LeBron, Dwyane Wade, etc, they are all black, but so is Biyombo, your logic would say he’s American, just like your logic says Tony Parker is not a Euro lol….

                  Don’t go back and forth on human origins with me, let’s take the LITERAL meaning as opposed to what people like you think. 

                  Skin color does not entirely determine ethnicity. I thought this was common sense, but thanks for showing that common sense is not all that common.

                • Veritas Vindice

                  Asswipe can’t read eh? I wrote I meant Serge Ibaka, but you conveniently chose to ignore that. But that’s to be expected from a wuss like you. Your ‘GM’ posts have been lame-ass here and on Doug’s blog so that’s pretty consistent. Now that Ibaka has a Spanish passport, is he Spanish? Is that the ‘literal’ meaning you’re pushing for? If it is, your ‘common sense’ is pretty retarded.

                • GM

                  Lol, you just stay mad, whether you meant Ibaka or Biyombo doesn’t make a difference and still makes your post totally invalid, if not more invalid than before.

                  Your missing the point, Tony Parker is a Euro, he’s born in France, France is in Europe, that makes him a European in the broader context right? Or do you need a geography lesson in addition to the countless other subjects that you don’t have a clue on?

                  Doug’s blog? I’m sorry lol? Your paranoid self must’ve gotten me confused with someone else because there can apparently be only 1 GM on the internet lmao..

                  So your handle is Veritas, isn’t Veritas the goddess of truth of ancient Roman lore? That HAS to be you! I have you solved! 

                  Lol, idiot…just stay mad and be yourself.

                • Veritas Vindice

                  lol. Ok, you’re right. Ibaka’s a Euro. Now, let’s just be friends. I think you’re pretty cool. Really.

                • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

                  Tony Parker (SA), Boris Diaw (Cha), Mickael Pietruis (Phx), Alexis Ajinca (Tor), Nicolas Batum (PO), Ian Mahimni (Dal), Johan Petro (NJ), Kevin Seraphin (Was) & Ronny Turiaf (NYK) are all black Euros in the NBA.

                  I want AB traded ASAP, I don’t like his lazy ass at all- str8 up & down.

                • V.

                  ben gordon is born in england, loul deng lived in england since his early teens and has a citizenship

              • Daniel

                going to class?? 🙂

  • Johnn19

    Valanciunas as a back up center @ 18 during Euroleage games with Rytas, in 14.9mpg avg 7.7pts  71%FG and 5.8rbs, playing against experienced players on the best teams in Europe.
    Not that it’s the NBA, but an indication that he can compete, and will only get better as he continues to grow into his body and gains experience

    • Gradgrind101

      Valanciunas may turn out to be a good nba player someday but going forward it’s time to completely dismiss his Lithuanian league stats due to low overall skill level in that league. Pointing to Euroleague stats…And particularly stats that are generated in a backup role (since those are generally non-critical numbers)…Is nice but does not give me the sense that he is making worthwhile progress playing for Rytas. 

      JV has shown thus far that he has the skills and size that “project” him towards becoming a solid nba player at some point in the future.  I believe there are only 2 situations that will help Jonas develop moving forward. ONE: Playing in the nba or TWO: Playing starter minutes in Euroleague (much less desirable than the first choice). Anything other than that would be like Derrick Williams or Kyrie Irving deciding to play college ball one more year to further develop their game before moving on to the nba.

      In short JV needs more game. He ain’t gonna get that running endless pick n rolls against inferior defenders. He needs to be challenged to extend his game. He needs to develop some nba caliber post moves and mid range game. That will never happen playing Euroleague backup minutes or Lithuanian league starter minutes that are 2 or 3 levels below the nba.

  • Tbihis

    whats funny is people are saying, oh, he’s dominating the u19 but its not the euroleague. then maybe he does good in the euroleague then people are going to say, oh its not the NBA, then he does good in the NBA and people are going to say, oh, he’s not good enough….

    its never going to end.

    • Theswirsky

      whats funny is that hasn’t even happened yet. 

      yet people are already hinting at bias….

      its never going to end.

      • People are hinting at bias?  Are you kidding?  We’ve had people streaming anti-euro rants since before the draft.  And after?  You’d think that the message boards on this website were some kind of ethnocentric battle ground.  

        I’m really glad he isn’t coming here this year.  I think the best thing Colangelo could do is start dispensing free Meds for every Raps fan and whatever biochemical issue they may have.

        • Theswirsky

          “streaming anti-euro rants since before the draft”, and has that been the common practice?  Or was it anti bargnani rants that individuals, with their own bias mind you, interpretted as anti-euro because how could someone not like the ‘best player on the team’ otherwise?

          As for after the draft… do you mean for the 6 hours after and then by the next morning 85% of people were for the pick (of which people were actually worried that BC had drafted another Bargnani and not necessarily just another Euro).  And of the 15% still against the pick, could you possibly say that every single one of those was based on nothing more than him being “euro”? 

          There may a be a few individuals, who speak loudly, that want nothing to do with any baller who is Euro.  But they do not account for anything but a small minority. 

          And what about the people who have criticised NCAA basketball or Walker/Knight/TT?  Can I just call all of them racist or biased?  I’ve heard more than a few anti-black rants and statements here to. 

          How about we allow people their criticisms and opinions without trying to delegitimize their opinion ahead of time and single out (and probably ignore) the dickheads instead.

          • Nope they were anti euro rants because they were aimed at JV who is nothing like Bargnani.  They’re from two different basketball planets and yet were compared like they’re from the same womb…nice try.  Epic fail.

            And if you think people are criticizing Walker/Knight or TT because they’re racist then howl it out loud.  You might be right with some people.  I would have had no problem with them taking any of those guys.  I think ultimately JV fills a greater need and after seeing him play and reading what the basketball pundits are saying about him I think he was also the best player available at five…but I was hyped about Knight specifically before the draft and was surprised when JV’s name was called at five…because I didn’t know much about him at the time.

            • And if the dickheads are a minority, they were the loudest craziest tea party like minority on the message boards for the week after.  

              I’m all about healthy debate and having opinions based on educated opinions…aka collating the opinions of other people who have seen these people play in person and have a track record for evaluating talent at the next level.  Most of the people on here got flung in to a reactive state which detached them from the muscles they would generally use for critical thinking.  

              C’mon…you know what I’m saying is true.  

              A wise man once said, don’t let the crazy person drive the bus.

              • Theswirsky

                I don’t think what you are saying is true.

                People didn’t know much about Jonas, assumed he would be another Bargnani, when they found out he wasn’t they changed their tune.

                Feel free to think this is somehow xenophobia or racism because of a few people shortly after the draft… but the reality is it was a short term back lash exposing the fans desperate resistence to Vegetable Lasagna.

                Thos crazy people aren’t driving the bus, they are sitting at the back making alot of noise but somehow you are confusing them with the busdriver.

              • what about barni

                you should not be driving the bus

    • No other 2011 NBA Draft players were in the U19.  3 potential 2012 NBA Draft players were in the U19.  Three.  And there might have been a few potential 2013 NBA Draft players. 

      As a top 5 pick from the 2011 NBA Draft, he was supposed to dominate them. 

      If he does well in Euroleague, it’ll be a good thing.

      • You know what will be really interesting, is if the lockout continues and JV finds himself playing with or against a bunch of actual NBA players. 

      • So none of the Euro players are potential draftees next year?  Are you sure?

        • I just checked the latest mocks and there doesn’t look to be any premium talent coming out of Europe for the next couple of years.

      • Jonny1122

        Davis Bertans from Latvia was in it from 2011 draft and Patric Young, Tim Hardaway Jr, Keith Appling, Jeremy Lamb, Tony Mitchell, Lucas Noguiera and Dario Saric were among the potential members the 2012 and 2013 draft classes. 

    • Veritas Vindice

      What’s funny is people speculating either way before he gets here. Wait. That’s not funny. It’s what people on a message board do.

  • Rpsfan95

    the euro setup is kind of like soccer, he will play in the LKL all Lithuanian league, then if that team is good enough they qualify for the euroleague (which Rytas did last year) against other euro teams that are far better, I’m not an expert, maybe someone can explain it better, but Euroleage and LKL are two different things

    • Riego

      Completely different. The level of the Lithuanian league is low. The level of Euroleague is much higher. Euroleague teams are selected by the Union of European Basketball Leagues. Before 2001 the teams that classified higher in their torunamets, qualified for the Euroleague, but in 2001 the format of the tournament changed and since 2006 some teams had contracts signed to participate even if the didn’t performed well in their home league last season. That makes that each years, the TOP teams in Europe play the Euroleague, and with TOP I mean in all around aspects.

  • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

    I could give a flying fuck what Jonas does until the 2012 Vegas NBA Summer League, 2012 Rap’s Training Camp, 2012 NBA Preseason then the NBA regular season going up against rookie, potential & proven NBA players until then it’s all hype and it’s- not my type of hype. (Full Force voice)

    • Nilanka15

      But the same can be said about every single rookie ever drafted.  So the question is, why is there so much skeptism regarding Valanciunas over any other rookie?

      Even if we picked Walker, everything you said above would still apply.  That is, nobody should believe the hype until Walker’s played against proven NBA players. 

      There’s a bit of a double-standard with these two players.

      • Scottbbaird

        “So the question is, why is there so much skeptism regarding Valanciunas over any other rookie?”

        He was drafted by Toronto.  Land of the skeptics.

      • Sek99

        The NCAA has you playing against usually 30-50 players who will be in the NBA next year, some who will become all-stars and superstars. The euro-league has you playing the likes of Linas Kleiza and Josh Childress (who were on the winning team a few years ago). Harrison Barnes, Derrick Williams, Kyrie Irving, and others are much better than most, if not probably all Euroleague players, because the best euroleague players would come to the NBA if they were really good. The fact is that Kemba had to beat many of the teams with these potential allstars and superstars, not to mention the legendary coaches that litter the NCAA. JV, by no fault of his own, has simply faced lesser competition, both in the Lithuanian league and in the U19 tourney. That gives Kemba more credibility at this point.

        • Ihatehaters

          Top players in NCAA are better, but many teams also have considerable “filler” – guys that won’t make the NBA, or even play in Europe. Top level guys, I agree NCAA is better; but, that doesn’t necessarily make it a better (or tougher) “league”.

          • Kevin Oppella

            The top ncaa players MAY be better than euro talent (some are, some are not) but remember Div.-I ball in the states has over 300+ schools and 300×12 players per team is over 3600 players and the top players are usually represented on 15-20 teams in usually seen in the March Madness tourney which is a 65 team tourney. that roughly works out to less that 2% of potential professional basketball talent and around 98% of players who will never play a meaningful game of basketball past there senior year. Each year of course.

            • Sek99

              But in order to win (like Kemba did) you do have to beat top talent or at least teams that beat other teams with top talent, like Harrison Barnes team, Kyrie Irvings team and Derrick Williams team.

              • Kevin Oppella

                So then JV has to do the same thing in Lithuania and EuroLeague.

                • Sek99

                  Right, but it’s a fact that top talent is better in the NCAA, proving my argument.

                • Nilanka15

                  Yeah, but top talent doesn’t always translate to the best “teams”.  Just like the 2004 Pistons.  They certainly weren’t the most talented individuals, but together, they were a great team.

        • Jonathan

          You don’t have a clue what you’re talking about.

          First, what an American-centric view you have there.

          Second, you’re comparing apples and oranges.  The European clubs aren’t teams of 18-21 year olders.  They are teams of men, much older than your typical NCAA teams.  So while it’s probably true that they don’t have as much talent (the US has an amazing infrastructure for developing top athletes, starting from high school onward), the question isn’t which league pumps out more stars — it’s which teams are harder to play against.  Your typical NCAA teams may have one or two prospects, but it’s not like they field a rotation of grown men.

          • Sek99

            Does the Euro league have players the caliber of Dwayne Wade, Melo, Derrick Rose, Russel Westbrook, Kevin Durant etc. If anyone were given a choice between the top Euroleague player or any of these players at 18-21, everyone would chose these superstars. Manu Ginobli, Gasol’s and other great European players come to the NBA. Pretty sure you don’t know what you’re talking about. Talent is talent, just like if JV was playing an under 19 tournament against people the caliber of Kyrie Irving and Derrick Williams with pretty decent teams, then obviously I would be stocked. But the best players come from America, that’s a fact. Not saying greats can’t come from Europe or around the world, but most of the best players in the NBA played in NCAA at one point or another. That makes it a better league.

            • Well Spain took all of there best down to the wire in the Gold medal game…and they did it with a seventeen year old point guard because their regular point guard was hurt…Lebron and Wade were on that team.  So sorry…these guys are no where near as bullet proof as you’re trying to make them out to be.  

              • Sek99

                I also know that they won several games by 40 points or something ridiculous. And Spain’s top players play in the NBA, and I’m pretty sure a bunch of them played in the NCAA anyway.

                • You’re pretty sure are you?  Wow that’s concise educated reasoning at it’s finest.  Spain has some excellent players that play in the NBA no question, they were still weaned in the Euro league right? Completely invalidating your previous post right?

                • Riego

                  None of the TOP Spanish players has ever played in the NCAA: None. And you were preety sure… LOL

            • PellsBells

              JV dominated and embarrassed Patric Young at the tournament (who is an American projected to be a lottery pick in next years draft).

            • Riego

              Gasol and company came to the NBA because of the talent there, yes, but most because of the paycheck 😐

              It has always been the same and always will be: in USA prospects spent a lot of time in the gym, in Europe they spent it learning the fundamentals of the game. Each system has his positive and negative things, and sometimes ends with subproducts: smart guys with no athleticism all or pro-athletes that hasn’t seen a bball in their lives.

              As an example, since I remember, the Spanish League teams has signed players from USA, players that couldn’t make an NBA roster. Some of them, with time, learn a little and become good basketball players, but many off them have only their athleticism and become busts here. One coach said some years ago, in a press conference, something that cost him a big fine for racism, despite that wasn’t his intention. Talking about Demetrius Alexander (who plays in Greece now I think) after a loss, he told about him that he was a NAF, what means Negro atlético fraudulento = fraudulent athletic black. That was referring that many of the players from USA only have athleticism because that is what they are told to improve since they are children. Meanwhile, in Europe, athleticism has never been considered the main part of a bball player.Diferent systems, only, no one better than the other, but you just cannot compare. When a good player has time to improve in the other aspects, become a good player anywhere.Sorry for my english and for the long narration…

          • Sek99

            Hell, just remembered something. Linas Kleiza was the best player on team Lithuania last summer when they came in second or third or somewhere that high. He would have been playing against the top talent of every country in the world. Guess which team dominated? The U.S. The fact is that in the euroleague, Josh Childress and Kleiza are stars, and if you tell me you’d rather have them over any of the top ten picks this year, you’d be crazy. I guess it might be too American-centric saying America dominated though. . . 

        • points

          +100 well said

        • No they will be better than most.  That’s the thing you’re not factoring in here.  When they are that age (unless they’re Lebron) they are not the player they are going to be.  He’s playing against grown men in Europe that would dominate against the NCAA teams…that’s what Giveny was saying and I guarantee you he has a hell of a lot more Basketball gravitas than any of us.

          • Theswirsky

            so if Jonas is playing against “grown men” in Europe, why should we be impressed that he is dominating kids?

            • Because he dominated people his own age.  As he gets older…are you following…if he develops properly he should dominate other people.  He’s the first player in European history to have been named the MVP of the U16, U18 and the U19 game.  Nowitzki didn’t do it.  Pau didn’t do it…nobody.  

              I’m not saying he’s going to be them, but what I am saying is that there are a lot of indications that he could end up being really good.  

              And the only metric you seem to be basing your opinion on is snarky cynicism.  

              • Theswirsky

                so since he dominates people his own age “if” he develops properly he should dominate others?

                Sounds like every other young prospect to ever play basketball.  

                This has NOTHING to do with Jonas… it has everything to do with his level of competition in that tournament.

        • Raps Loyalist

          You obviously know nothing of the Euroleague.  There is a lot of players over there right now that are better than Barnes, Williams, and Irving at this point in their lives.  Do they have as much potential to be great NBA players in 4/3 years? No, but that doesn’t mean that right now that they aren’t better.  Look at guys like Garbo.  According to you he played in the Euroleague so there is no way he could have been any good in the NBA but he was a good player for the Raps.  Manu played in the euroleague…was he trash? Or take a look at Brandon Jennings. Brutal in europe ROY canidate in the NBA the next year.  This lookout will be great for the Euroleague because a lot of stars will go over there and no dominate as much as people think they will.  The US media thinks America is the greatest at everything in the world and nothing can compare to America.  They ram this opinion down everyones throats..truth is the euroleague’s top teams would do better in the NBA than a lot of NBA teams do. 

          Don’t confuse potential with what is right now in the moment.  JV playing in europe is just as good for him as playing in the NCAA. Plus, don’t think for a second that he wouldn’t be one of the top players in the NCAA next year.  Kemba was the benefactor of a really shitty year in the NCAA.  He is not a #5 pick. Bradon Knight I would have been fine with but I would have lost my mind if Kemba was are pick (he’s got heart and talent but he is small and not a natural point guard…he is BAYLESS 2.0) Anybody that thinks he is gonna be some great NBA player is a moron. 

          • Mike. R

            Exactly, well said.

      • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

        Some rookies have more data points than others plus talent level varies from draftee to draftee from projected potential to actual factual- recognize.

        Winning, leading a team to, a NCCA title is no small feat especially for a team pick to finish 10th in the Big East (in the preseason) arguably the toughest college basketball conference in the Nation.

        The double standard is in your reprobate mind, buddy.

        • Poke

          The double standard is in your ignorance. Like many American-centric fans you seem to think that because you don’t see the talent in europe that it doesn’t exist. I would guess that you have seen very little if any european basketball but that doesn’t stop you from being overconfident in what you actually know about evaluating talent.

          • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!


            Is this the new racist, prejudice, xenophobic propaganda code word in usage?lmfao

            Did I say that no NBA talent exist is Europe?

            No I did not.

            I recognize that many talented players have come from Europe to the NBA but many more have come from the US- point blank!!

            Fyi- I grew up in the NW watching ex Sonics Detlef Schrempf & Sarunas Marciulionis plus ex Blazer Drazen Petrovic who all hustled hard and played the game the right way unlike Bargnani.

            So you can stop acting, guessing like you know what the fuck you are talking about when it comes to me as all you know is what I post stop worring about me and start worring about the Rap’ future under BC and his crew of lackeys ie company yes men, my ignorant friend.

            • Jonny1122

              Liking your own comments again?

              Obviously more NBA players are American. I could say the same thing about how there are so many Spannish players in the ACB League.Also watching Euros on NBA teams doesn’t stop you from thinking anyway about them, positive or negative. That’s like a clearly racist guy saying he isn’t racist because he knows a black guy. 

              Also just to be clear, I am not calling you a racist, I am calling you an idiot.

              • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

                Liking my own comments? Inspector E Gadget, wtf are you talking about?lmfao

                The rest of your post is 100% pure facetious balderdash just like your sex life with your right hand- man on man.

                Btw- U win the ‘I’m stuck on stupid’ badge for the day- enjoy & congrats I know your 2 moms would be so proud of you, kiddo, you’re a chip of off the old clit. 

                • Jonny1122

                  lol here we go, nothing to say to my argument, so you start attacking me personally.

                  BTW you said the rest of my post is facetious and made up like the sex life with my right hand. So.. I never masturbate ever because I just make it all up? Not sure that’s what you were going for with that one..

                  Don’t worry I get it, I have no sex life and I masturbate profusely. I am very hurt and I might have to cry a little, good day.

                • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!


                • Jonny1122

                  So here we are at the bottom of the well. It appears there is nothing left for BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!! to think of. Just like a child screaming ‘Shut up!’ and stomping out of the room.

                • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

                  So says you.lmfao

                • Jonny1122

                  I know you are! But what am I?

         I doing it right?

      • Theswirsky

        “why is there so much skeptism regarding Valanciunas over any other rookie”

        I really don’t think there are.  The vast majority of people support this draft pick.

        Now the skepticism with the u19 tournament I understand… its an U19 tournament after all. 

        • Sek99

          I wouldn’t say the vast majority. . . I know a lot of people who range from upset to highly skeptical on this pick. 

          • Wow, upset to highly skeptical.  That’s a big range (sarcasm, cough cough)…

            How about intrigued.  Excited.  

            I haven’t heard one significant Basketball mind say anything other than this kid is one of the top picks in the draft bar none. And yet apparently the neurosis of the Toronto Basketball fans seems to invent things to freak out about.

            If you have some kind of legitimate information that you’re not being beamed from outer space would you care to share it with us.

            • Sek99

              How about how ‘basketball minds’ were high on a lot of players throughout history who were busts, and low on players who become greats. It’s not an exact science, so we can’t judge until we see him play. If you want to be excited, that’s your opinion. You’re probably only looking at potential.  People like that think within the next 3 years Bargnani will be better than Dirk (he certainly has the potential). Beyond everything on how good he is or not, if he’s paired with Bargnani and doesn’t put on these 30-40 pounds everyone says he needs to, we have another PF. But, hey, the more potential the better, right? I mean, T’Wolves are clearly championship bound, we should follow their example (sarcasm, cough, cough)

              • Did I say it was an exact science?  Wow…yes that’s true they can be wrong.  But I need you to hold on to reality for one second…the reason they make the big bucks and you don’t is because they’re right infinitely more than you are.  They’re basketball IQ is infinitely higher than yours.  They’re grandmother’s basketball IQ is infinitely higher than yours.

                So if I have a choice of believing a collective opinion of the basketball braintrusts who have made their opinions apparent or the bipolar off their meds Raptors fans…I’m looking you straight in the eye…I’m going to pick them every time…but hey grab a beer and swing from the stripper pole with your friends and make assumptive statements that have absolutely no bearing in the real world.

          • Theswirsky

            wasn’t the RR poll at 85% for the pick? (I may be a bit off on that number)

            • Sek99

              The RR polls are of about what, like 300 people? There are thousands of raptors fans, if not hundreds of thousands in the city. Doesn’t quite count as a consensus.

              • Arsenalist

                RR poll is between 1300-1700 ppl.

                • Sek99

                  Sure, ok, that’s a lot more than I thought, but still a very small sample size of a much larger population.

                • Theswirsky


                • Mike. R

                  It’s enough to garner some meaningful information I’d say.

    • Ezekial

      Wow. You’re a beast bro. Wouldn’t want to mess with you in real life. Word.

      • Jonny1122

        Agreed, I wouldn’t want to mess with that “Full Force voice” of his..

      • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

        Actually I’m as kool as a summer breeze when it hits a woman’s

    • DonFiasko

      What has more impact in the life of Raptor truthers…….your posts or Valanciunas’ accomplishments? If you were to answer, it would likely be the former.

      • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!


    • Bo4

      To me, the only interesting question is, “Whom does Jonas knock out of the rotation up front: Amir? Ed? or Andrea?” I vote for Andrea, for two reasons: 1) He’ll bring back a better player in a trade, & 2) He’s by far the worst defensive player of the four.

      • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

        If Val’s selection meant AB was going to be traded ASAP then I would be more willing to accept it at face value (projected potential) but if it means that AB will move to PF with  Ed and/or Amir being moved to accommodate this transition then no way Jose.

        Personally, I would rather pair Val up with Ed & Amir than with Bargnani while trading Bargnani for veteran talent and draft picks to add to the Rap’s overall roster talent level depth chart.

        • Kevin Oppella

          I can agree to that. 

        • cesco

          I don’t want a repeat of the twins towers (aka twins living near the basket). If it didn’t work with an all-star and a former all-star why should it work with the Jonas , Ed , Amir triumvirate . Notice that the NBA champs had an outside/in shooter who kept spreading the floor .

          • sleepz

            Yes they did. His name was Dirk Nowtzki who is a potential Hall of Famer.

            There is no comparison to be made with the Raptors.

        • Finally found something we can agree on.  I was holding out hope.

        • Riego

          Me agree too, I gave up on Bargnani (I know I should have done it long time ago, but I’ve always been an optimistic xD ), but the time to trade him is this season, in order to take the best benefit from the picks…The problem is that I don’t see anyody giving even a high ’12 draft pick for him, given his reputation of a good scorer but a horrible defender…

          That’s why he’ll be here at least another season, what give us time to see what Casey can do with hi (I don’t expect any miracle…).

          • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

            BC might as well petition the NBA to rename the team as the- Toronto Bargnanis’, as much as BC caters to Bargnani aka King Bargs aka The Pope aka Golden Child aka Lazy Moo’fer aka Spoiled Brat aka I’m A 7’1 250 Pound PF.

      • points

        you must understand that Andrea is going nowhere,she a lifer with the raps or until her father goes trust me (BC voice)

        • Bo4

          That’s what I’m afraid of … BC’s Fatal Flaw, if you’ll forgive the excess gravity of it …

  • Mediumcore

    I wonder whom Jonas would have more sucess with on the pick and roll. Calderon or Bayless? Bayless is quicker and more explosive, and has a good mid range jump shot. Calderon has made a decent living with Bosh and Amir on the pick n’ roll as well.

    I think the real problem will be when Jonas’ defender sags off him on that play and forces him to make a 15 foot jump shot. Hopefully he can add that to his game over the lock out period.

    • sleepz

      Calderon. When Bayless gets a pick he is always looking to score and when he does pass, it’s because he couldn’t get to the lane.

      I also anticipate that Bayless will not be on this team come 2012, but thats just my humble opinion

      • Mediumcore

        Good point about Bayless looking to score first. Hopefully being traded as many times as he has over his short career will make him realize that a change in his game is required. The frustrating part is that he has all the physical tools to be a good point guard, but he’s just too much of a bone head.

    • Nilanka15

      If his free throw mechanics are any indication, adding a mid-range jumper should be fairly effortless.

      • BCGheradiniJayGots2Go!!!

        If Alex English were still around………….Rap’s have no big man coach on their new coaching staff:

        Head Coach- Casey
        Lead Assistant- Davis

        I still can’t believe that Hughes, Roth & Nori all got retained under Casey but not the great Alex English- wow?

        • I think I read somewhere that English is fielding other offers. 

      • Mediumcore

        Agreed. In the “Jonas is the next…” thread I felt like he could be a hybrid of Noah and A. Stoudamire because of the way he attacks the rin on the pick n’ roll, but if he can refine his shot he may turn out to be more Stat. than Noah imho.

  • John

    The more i read about him and his offense and his game, the more I think his presence and Ed will make Amir the ODD man out. Right now, Amir is the primary beneficiary of pick n roll with Jose.

    • points

      fuck Calderon!

      • Riego

        nice argument :/

  • Ben

    It’s easy to just go and look at JV’s post-game stats and make an assumption, but that does little in terms of assessing his value as an NBA player.

    It’s what doesn’t show in the stats that make scouts/GMs so high on him. Players are drafted on potential and not the numbers they put up on their level on play, if that were the case then NCAA leading season scorers would be drafted 1st every year, the Jimmers, the Kembas, the Reddicks, the Adam Morrisons etc. It is simply not the case.

    As I said, it is easy for us, as fans, to approve or disapprove of a young draftee by reading the box scores, but there is much more to it.

    Of course the 20+ points and 10+ rebounds a game Jonas put up were impressive, it was HOW he did it. The developing post game, the defensive awareness, the instincts, the willingness to lay it all on the floor to win a game, and the emotion and fire he had exhibited whether his team lost or won. He has those rare things that you just can’t teach, in addition to his ever-improving skills.

    Of course you want to put SOME emphasis on numbers, but it helps to read reports and thoughts from those that have watched him play live.

    So if Jonas puts up numbers this season for Lietuvos Rytas that come nowhere close to what he put up in the U19 tournament, don’t be discouraged, because by all accounts, this kid is a player, and anyone of importance in the basketball world will agree.

    • Veritas Vindice

      Who cares what ‘anyone of importance in basketball’ would or would not agree on. The vast majority of experts make wrong picks come draft time since only a handful actually become stars. Everyone on this board is just shootin the shizznatch because they’re entitled to. I think the big V will turn out all right and bargnani is a waste of roster space and nothing the ‘experts’ think will change my opinion. If the big V turns out to be a bust and Bargs becomes an allstar next year, I’d change my mind, but the opinions of a group of sports journalism geeks don’t mean jack.

      • Ricky

        You’re missing the point of what he’s trying to say..

        I’d like to see how you’d rank the top 10 prospects in the 2011 draft WITHOUT any information from scouts/GMs/experts…. where would you start?

        “Who cares what ‘anyone of importance in basketball’ would or would not agree on” ————–Lots of people care, that’s what these guys get paid for…

        Quite frankly, I’d take the opinions of a group of “sports journalism geeks” over yours any day of the week.

        • Veritas Vindice

          LMAO. If I don’t give a rat’s ass what a group of experts think, you think I’d give  rat’s dick what Ricky thinks? L.M.A.O.

          • Ricky

            Ya, you cared enough to reply. Thanks moron. I’m sure you wouldn’t care if I called you a moron either, great attitude.

            • Veritas Vindice

              Oooh. Name calling? Ricky’s pissed. Caring about what someone says and shittin with them are two different things. The first shows respect, and the second is is just a fun way to pass the time. So yeah, I don’t mind pissin on you, especially since you obviously just sit there with your slackjawed mouth open. I’ve seen enough of your pathetic validation-seeking posts to know you’re not the brightest basketball mind on the board. Wait a sec. Maybe I DO care about you Ricky.  Want to be my friend?

              • Ricky

                Lol, “a fun way to pass the time.”

                If your idea of being outwardly vulgar on the internet is a fun way to pass the time, then you need to find a job and become a contributing member to society.Until then, keep passing the time lolol.

  • This Tim and Sid KID comes through again with some bonus Jonas news and his thoughts on the upcoming Senior Mens team.