New York Knicks 100 FinalRecap | Box Score 115 Toronto Raptors
Amir Johnson, PF Shot Chart 33 MIN | 3-6 FG | 2-3 FT | 8 REB | 1 AST | 0 STL | 4 BLK | 3 TO | 8 PTS | +23Played his regular game, which is obviously good. I’m not sure about the nickname, Doctor of Denial, but he did have four big blocks and played good defense tonight. He wasn’t much of a scorer, tonight, but his 6 offensive rebounds hurt the Knicks.

Jonas Valanciunas, C Shot Chart 27 MIN | 1-4 FG | 7-8 FT | 10 REB | 1 AST | 0 STL | 0 BLK | 3 TO | 9 PTS | +18Would have played more if the refs weren’t calling fouls whenever he touched Chandler. He’s rebounding much better, now, including going and getting rebounds he wouldn’t have before. The Raptors defense noticeably weakened when he left the court.He’s still got to curb those turnovers, but another good night for him.

Kyle Lowry, PG Shot Chart 38 MIN | 10-17 FG | 8-10 FT | 8 REB | 11 AST | 1 STL | 0 BLK | 1 TO | 32 PTS | +19Two rebounds shy of a triple double, with 32 points. A very impressive box score for Lowry and he hit some killer shots on the Knicks.The only downside was he let the much slower Beno Udrih into the lane far too much, but that’s nitpicking. If the Raptors are trading him, which they should, he’s certainly raising his value with his play of late.

DeMar DeRozan, SG Shot Chart 36 MIN | 7-18 FG | 6-7 FT | 4 REB | 4 AST | 3 STL | 0 BLK | 3 TO | 20 PTS | +19Missed a lot of shots early, but got on track and had several cuts to the basket near the end where he delivered. A good, but not great night for DeRozan.

Terrence Ross, SG Shot Chart 32 MIN | 8-16 FG | 0-0 FT | 4 REB | 1 AST | 2 STL | 0 BLK | 0 TO | 23 PTS | +9So this is the shooting touch we heard about when Ross was drafted. Was an astounding 7-11 from three and hit some timely shots that stopped a couple of Knicks runs. Still struggles defensively, at times, but we’re seeing glimpses of the player Raptor fans hoped when he was drafted.

Tyler Hansbrough, PF Shot Chart 15 MIN | 0-0 FG | 1-2 FT | 3 REB | 0 AST | 0 STL | 0 BLK | 0 TO | 1 PTS | -8Not much of an impact on the boards and got worked on by Amare Stoudemire in the post. One wonders if he’s still hurt, or just struggling because of reduced playing time.

Patrick Patterson, PF Shot Chart 21 MIN | 4-7 FG | 0-0 FT | 6 REB | 0 AST | 1 STL | 0 BLK | 0 TO | 9 PTS | -3He got killed defensively, but grabbed some boards and hit some shots.

John Salmons, SF Shot Chart 23 MIN | 0-4 FG | 2-2 FT | 2 REB | 4 AST | 1 STL | 0 BLK | 0 TO | 2 PTS | +7Didn’t score much, but made a difference on the defensive end and passing the ball. Salmons is living up to his reputation for playing well after he’s traded. He’s become the new Alan Anderson, but one who’s not a trigger happy.

Greivis Vasquez, PG Shot Chart 15 MIN | 3-8 FG | 2-2 FT | 0 REB | 1 AST | 0 STL | 0 BLK | 4 TO | 11 PTS | -9Horrible in the first half, hit some huge threes in the second half.

Chuck Hayes, PF Shot Chart DNP COACH’S DECISION MIN | FG | FT | REB | AST | STL | BLK | TO | PTS | Toronto looking a lot like Sacramento for Hayes. The view from the bench looks the same most places.

Landry Fields, SF Shot Chart DNP COACH’S DECISION MIN | FG | FT | REB | AST | STL | BLK | TO | PTS | Curses the day Salmons rode into town. Salmons basically does everything Fields does, but Salmons can shoot. So Fields can rest up for quality time with his girlfriend.

Steve Novak, SF Shot Chart DNP COACH’S DECISION MIN | FG | FT | REB | AST | STL | BLK | TO | PTS | Not even Novak can shoot from the bench.

Julyan Stone, SG Shot Chart DNP COACH’S DECISION MIN | FG | FT | REB | AST | STL | BLK | TO | PTS | Curses the day Vasquez rode into town. Vasquez can do everything Stone can do, but Vasquez can also play basketball at an NBA level.

Dwane Casey
Didn’t exactly wow anyone with his sets, but didn’t screw up and the rotations weren’t bad.

Three Things We Saw

  1. Did anyone else notice how DeRozan seemed to be FAR more friendly with Shumpert before tipoff than Bargnani?
  2. Maybe someone at the game can tell me, but was a section cheering for Bargnani whenever he scored? It sounded like it to me.
  3. The Knicks defense looked AWFUL, but when you have J.R. Smith and Andrea Bargnani on the same team, that’s probably going to happen. I’ll get into this more tomorrow, but the Knicks over help, are easily taken out by simple plays and don’t seem to have a clue who they need to defend.

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  • Cameron Becker

    TRoss!! Most of my posts here are in support of him, always believed he was a big time talent and am happy to see him finally getting his opportunity consistently, hopefully Casey doesn’t screw with that.

    But I’m impressed with how Demar has improved. Wasn’t his best game but it’s so noticeable how the game has slowed down for him now, often making correct reads and good passes either to JV under the basket or T Ross in the corner that he may not have made previously. Love this team again, although for the pro tankers, they may be a bit too good!


    even when the raptors are playing well i still fear the other team to come back against them and they almost did. Casey needs to get on his players more when they re up big or they start cruising smh.

  • vanlivin
    • JRedmond14

      Other than being an awful trade for the Raptors, it’s pretty good…

  • Timo In Waterloo

    Business taken care of. Chicago next.

  • Tanks-a-lot

    Chandler only had 2 rebounds
    JV deserves an A when you take that into account. Not to mention that JV stood up to Chandler and wasn’t rattled in any way. Stone cold ice in the face of that giant neckbeard mf’er.

    • morgan c

      Easy there. I’d say Amir deserved more of the credit for limiting Chandler’s boards, if anyone, and Chandler still got 16 pts. I live in the States and can only seldom watch Raptors games, but is this all JV is? I really want him to be the franchise player so many say he is, but he looks lost defensively half the time, is predictable on offense, and turns the ball over. He hustles and can rebound, but he has miles to go to even touch all-star caliber level.

      Great game nonetheless and really enjoyed watching Raptors seem like they were having fun. Lowry was amazing and TRoss was great. But ya, JV hasn’t quite developed into the force he should be by now.

      • Tanks-a-lot

        Amir and Val are a frontcourt that works well together.

        I’m not worried about the ‘franchise’ player label for JV. That will come if he continues to get the minutes and keeps deciding to “out-center” the opposing team’s center.

      • Saskatoon Raps Fan

        He’s a European big man in his 2nd yr. you are right that he’s not an all star calibre player yet, but it unfair to say he hasn’t developed into the force he should be. Give him some time, he’s progressing nicely

      • Cameron Becker

        How can you come to that conclusion specifically after stating you don’t watch many raptors games? Even tonight JV actually performed quite well even though hampered with foul problems, he contributed to the game contesting shots and grabbing contested rebounds. Chandler scored a number of points due to Lowry getting blown by early in the game and JV having to come over and help.

      • Dr. Dread

        you can stream every game over the net if u want to watch raptors games for free. …

        • morgan c

          atdee,net/tv, right? Haha, ya I use that site a lot. When I say seldom, I meant like 7-8 so far this year. Regardless, I follow every game on this site, gamecast, boxscores, etc, so I do think I know what I’m talking about. It’s not like I’m the only voice saying JV hasn’t blossomed into the guy so many predicted yet. I read it here all the time, and minus Tim W, every contributor here is a huge JV fan. So I can tell it’s pretty objective. Not a hater; I really hope the guy becomes great. But I do feel like so many of us make excuses for him, when really, he needs to become much more consistent. Just one thing specifically: he is SO SLOW switching or going back to his man on the pick and roll it’s fucking ridiculous.

      • why

        Agree that last night wasn’t his greatest game however since the Gay trade JV has improved by leaps and bounds. and at 21 he is ahead of where Noah, Hibbert, etc. were at the same age.
        For that matter Amir, Lowrey, and Ross are also, playing at a much higher level since the Gay trade and when coupled with the additional depth the trade brought to the team sending Fields, Stone, and Novak out of the rotation and to the bench, this is the first time since Bosh got hurt after the all-star break in 2010 that The Raps look like a competive NBA team.

  • Adriiian

    Great game. Let’s go RAPTORS!
    Why should we trade Kyle the way he’s playing? I guess his price will go up in the off season.. Maybe Ujiri is thinking about resigning him?

    • mountio

      Its either 4 years at $40 mm + or have him walk. Despite the great play (hes been awesome) the last few games .. Im not sure Id pay him that. So – if you can get a first rounder now – you have to do it.

    • Saskatoon Raps Fan

      I think Nene could be an example of ujiri is thinking with Lowry, when he surprised everyone with the new contract he gave nene before shipping him off to Washington. Lowry will be worth more in a trade once he’s not an expiring contract. Also gives ujiri the chance to bide his time and get the best deal possible. Or we just hold onto Lowry. I’d be happy with that right now

  • mountio

    Cant say Im at all surprised that TR is shooting better from 3 now that he is actually getting some decent looks, as the team actually has ball movement. A bunch of his shots last year were step back 3s and contested threes that even the best shooter in the league wouldnt hit. Imagine what %age hed be shooting if he played for someone like San Antonio!
    Also, ill keep beating this horse until its dead, but Salmons over Ross down the stretch is a brutal decision. Not that Salmons is playing bad – hes actually playing quite well, especially defensively. BUT, Ross brings much more offensively and more importantly is a guy who is here for the long haul – he needs to get confidence down the stretch.
    Gotta give huge props to KL. He is the #1 reason (by far) for our better play since the Gay trade. Hes been great. If we trade him – Ill miss what hes been bringing. Horrible NYK team, but two solid wins none the less.

  • AB4EYE

    We might was well cut Hansbrough and let him go somewhere else and get PT like we did with DJ and play Chuck! We are treating Tyler like shit right now. He never gets passed the ball especially for a guy 16.3 PER36 PPG before coming here, he got his PT cut nearly in half since the trade and we have him playing out of position against far bigger and stronger players. He was one of the better defenders in the NBA according to synergy stats when playing guys closer to his size so we move him to center when he was already an undersized PF to begin win.

    He’s been passed the ball for ZERO FGA or FTA attempts the last two games in almost 30 MP! He has a rep for never passing but he has more assists than FGA since the last time someone passed him the rock near the paint. Rather amazing the team has 80 FGA tonight and he couldn’t even get up one in 15:16 while everyone else who played got at least 4.

    The dude was the 6th man on a team that should have knocked off the Heat last year in ECF and always scores big when given shots and yet he’s only our 9th man getting far less usage than anyone else all while playing out of his natural position? WTF is up with that, we took an assets we could have gave PT to and flipped for a first round pick but now now he’s not even going to get us anything since he never gets to score and all anyone is going to see is bigger dudes shooting over him in the post.

    He’s never been a shot blocker so I have no idea where the playing center idea came from?

    He’s gone 19 games since he’s taken more than 5 shots including 3 starts and in that game he broke the 5 shot mark he picked up 23 points and had seen 6 or more shots just two times all year, and in those two game he’s shooting 66% while Patrick Patterson has taken over 5 shots in 4 of the last 5 games. He had a career low 10.7 PER 36 FGA and 16.9 MP last year and that was enough for him to ask out of one of the best teams in the NBA, this year he’s at 7.0 and 18.1 before this game which will drop them both so I bet he’s counting down the days he gets traded.

    His mistreatment is so comical that not only does Casey and their teammates love Patterson more than Hansbrough so does the NBA’s score keepers. Last night he got an extra miss that should have been Patterson’s and then tonight Patterson gets credit for Hansbrough’s steal of a Martin pass that when right two with Pat no where close. They are 54 and 50 but one’s white and the other is black it shouldn’t be that hard, should it?

    At the end of the day its yet another wasted asset under DC who could have got us something of value just like Davis who we gave away and who I’m shocked didn’t warn his UNC bother about DC’s random rotation and odd PT allotment and is yet another strike on us that will lead to never getting another FA who we don’t overpay for.

    • mountio

      Wow. Thats a lot of passion for a guy who has been a career hustle guy / borderline scrub. Your not quite Paul Peplico with Gray .. but you are getting close ..

      • AB4EYE

        He’s gets called a hustle guy but dude can score the rock he has a career 1.29 Points per FGa which is very good. No reason he isn’t getting 10-14 a night off our bench with us waiting on which team is sending us a 1st to get him.

        • jjdynomite

          Hansbrough can’t shoot outside of 4 feet which means he is one-dimensional in scoring the rock (and gets blocked often). And thiis why Patterson, who can stretch the court, is getting more play. Being a big body doesn’t mean that much, ask Aaron Gray. And Hansbrough isn’t even very big.

          • AB4EYE

            Does it matter where you shoot from if you score more? At the end of the Day Hansbrough score 1.29 points per FGa while Patterson is at 1.10.

            Go look at Hansbrough’s numbers when he gets shots, I think you will be shocked by his production and shooting percentage, and then go look at his career numbers when getting less than 4 shots a game.

    • Tanks-a-lot

      “The dude was the 6th man on a team that should have knocked off the Heat”

      ding! ding! ding!

      • AB4EYE

        They would have won that series if their coach didn’t take out Hibbert and open the lane for the Heat to tie the game in regulation, and then he did it again in OT to lose by a point in a series they lost in 7.

        • Tanks-a-lot

          Do you think the Pacers are better than last year?
          That’s all that really matters for them. I like Tyler’s game, it’s a win helping game, as a 7th or 8th man. He has a role, no doubt, just didn’t fit what the Pacers were doing.
          There is the injury.
          Then there is just matchups. It’s not like Hansbrough is a forgotten man in an 82 game season.
          Nice soliloquy though.

          • AB4EYE

            The Pacers are better this year becuase of Paul George turning into a super star and scoring 6.5 more PPG this year while Lance Stephenson added 4.6 PPG, 2.8 REB and 2.2 more to his game from last year and the East is at an all time low.

            Hansbrough had the 3rd best Win hares rate on their team last year and is 3rd on ours this year he is a winning player.

            You have to no be watching if you don’t think Hansbroughi’s a forgotten man! He was getting over 21 MP a night since trade its down to under 13 a game!

            • Tanks-a-lot

              so it’s injury minutes. I would rather baby step him now and make sure he’s at his top level for the playoffs, if that’s what the team is trying to do. Why would you want to rush in Hansbrough when the team is getting by with the limited minutes requested of him?

              “Paul George turning into a super star”

              From playoff experience and the touches. He’s good, but he’s got to beat LeBron this year.

              Lance Stephenson is Larry Bird’s baby. More minutes and touches for him. He might have never amounted to anything without the luck to find the right place to be somebody.

              • AB4EYE

                Hansbrough been back for over 2 weeks its well past the stage of just nursing him back, teams are ready to make their moves to get a jump on a bad East and a great West if we don’t build that vlaue up soon we aren’t going to get anything and he will ask for a trade this winter if not sooner.

                • Tanks-a-lot

                  A separated shoulder (that’s the injury, right?) is a pain in the shoulder and always a little wonky.

                  How quickly are hockey players back and playing at top level after a separated shoulder?

                • AB4EYE

                  It wasn’t fully separated, if it was he wouldn’t even be thinking about playing with the injury. If they cleared him to play with added depth up front then he is good to go for the long haul.

        • Tanks-a-lot

          I don’t see the Heat making it past the Pacers this year.

          • StrikerAI

            I don’t either, especially since Lebron has been having more injuries than previous years, will it affect him in the Playoffs? Maybe, maybe not, and if Wade is not healthy, I don’t see the Heat winning.

            By the way, whatever happened to Greg Oden? Did he get injured again?

            • AB4EYE

              I read Oden practices I guess they are just saving him for playoffs.

          • AB4EYE

            They shouldn’t have last year either even before George and Stephenson took the next step.

    • Saskatoon Raps Fan

      Hansbrough saw his minutes reduced in his final yr in Indy. The pacers rode their starters way too hard because their bench (including Hans and DJ) was godawful. Why are u so passionate over those 2 scrubs? I wish we could’ve somehow included hansbrough in the trade and kept acy.

      • AB4EYE

        Hansbrough had a PER36 of
        15.0 and 9.8 and was 3rd on the teams in Win Shares Per48 and advanced stats said he was one of the best defenders at his position in the NBA so its clear the bench issues wasn’t on him. He asked out of Indy to look for more PT elsewhere and Bird let him.

        We are at a FA disadvantage to begin with so jacking around the few guys we get to come here is bad for business and the main reason I hate they way they were treated, secondly if we give those guys PT they expected we can move them for something to make us better long term rather than winning in a off the charts down year for the East.

        DJ is playing great right now for the Bulls getting 10.5 a night with 5.9 assists and his shot is coming back from getting his time shooting way over 55% his last half of his time with the Bulls so if they call it quits they will get a pick for him while we are paying for him.

        Having those 2 on cheap deals we should been going out of way to get them putting up numbers here since their value would be great for good teams in a cap crunch but instead we pissed off all their value.

        • Saskatoon Raps Fan

          3rd in wins share is surprising. I’ve always disliked hansbrough so I admit I’m probably biased.

          • AB4EYE

            Most people are bais becuase his game is ugly to the eyes, but his WS/48 is .153 since the start of last year only Amir is better on our roster over that period and its close with Amir being at .158.

  • da kid deebee
    • jjdynomite

      Interesting, but Barnes would be relatively redundant with Ross on the roster, though, no? I think Ross would have to go out on a trade like that for more assets (e.g. Draymond Green+2016 first rounder (Warriors traded their 2014).

      • da kid deebee

        Barnes has about two inches (and four inches of wingspan) on Ross, and I think plays more like a 3-slash-small-ball-4 whereas Ross is a 2/3; of course you’re completely right that there’d be a glut on the wing and there’d need to be more, other moves. i was more just trying to suggest that Lowry’s recent play may have the raptors able to finagle a decent asset in return, and GSW were said to be interested in him

  • ac1011990

    Wow Tross has looked very very good these past few games. The game just comes so easy to him, everyone loves talking about Valanciunus and his potential, but Tross doesn’t get the credit he deserves. I don’t think he’s going to stay just a 3 and D player, if he can improve his handles a bit and develop a better mid range game he may turn into something special.

    • jjdynomite

      Agreed, and to add, there’s nothing wrong at all for being a 3 and D player. Specialists like Wesley Matthews and Klay Thompson are pretty rare and that’s why they’re valued by their teams — and their teams are successful with them. If T-Ross can reach that level, the Raptor’s starting lineup will be pretty much complete.

      • Son of dad

        Tross can shoot and for some reason he isn’t our shooting guard. I can’t wait till Masai ships Derozan out of town, and it will happen. Derozan gets way to much credit in raptor nation, mostly because jerk offs like Doug Smith constantly pump his tires. He is a very inefficient shooter, below average defender and rebounder, turnover machine, huge salary (ala Bryan Colangelo). Hopefully they can trade him and/or Lowry and get a SF and slide Tross down to the 2 spot.

        • andre

          stfu dumbass

    • Kovalainnen

      T-Ross = Paul George Lite. Ross is only 8 months younger than George, but he’s progressing very fast, he has deadly shot, can play D and is so quick.. Now he all has to learn is how to drive to the basket and don’t be shy to the contact and improve his shot after dribble.

      • ac1011990

        Nah don’t think he’s going to be anywhere close to Paul. He’s not really a good rebounder and can’t facilitate like Paul, but he sure can shoot.

  • onemanweave

    Good assessment. Almost very good. We’ll give you an A- . What holds you back is the observation that Lowry needs to be traded.
    Right now, without inside info, we’re not sure what NEEDS to be done with Lowry. By the looks of the last few games and certainly tonight he looks like he needs to be extended. However none of us know how much and how long he’s asking for. Maybe too much. Maybe not.
    Unless he signs an extension, he probably isn’t going to bring back a great deal, but of course,you and I don’t know.
    What we do know is that trading Lowry at this time is probably going to result in a tailspin, probably enough to get sixth or seventh lottery pick. The common consensus is that there are seven or eight top quality draft picks. However experience and common sense says MAYBE there are two or three all-stars. One or two may slip back at the next level and one or two may stay in college and shoot for #1 pick next year. Is it worth tanking for the dregs of the “Big Eight’ if it means tearing out the drive shaft of a unit that’s running pretty well right now?
    Losing Lowry for nothing would hurt. So would watching the Raps slip back to the kind of performances we’ve seen in recent years.
    Saying we need to trade Lowry is as big a load as saying we need to keep him. It depends on a lot of things the guy on the street doesn’t know and Masai does. Fortunately for us, it’s him making the call. Again, good article.

    • Delabar’s Weighted Balls

      I agree I appreciate the assessments, just think Tim’s being a little hard on Patterson… Over 36 minutes he’d have 13.5 pts & 9 boards on >50% shooting… I thought he did a decent job, better than Vasquez that’s for sure

      • Tanks-a-lot

        Greasy drives me crazy.

    • Saskatoon Raps Fan

      I fully agree with what u are saying. It took me a long time to convince myself that trading Lowry was the right move. It took a lot of rudy gay induced depression I think. I always liked Lowry, but the team was just so bad with rudy. Now that rudy is gone and we’re seeing the pre injury Houston rockets Lowry again we have to keep him or we’ll just spend yrs looking for a point guard of his caliber all over again. If Masai feels like there’s a chance that he’ll resign I really hope he holds onto him

      • Saskatoon Raps Fan

        Also, Lowry seems to genuinely enjoy being the leader of this group right now. I don’t think resigning him is all that far fetched

    • #TankNation

      Right, except that there aren’t “MAYBE” two or three all-stars. The 2014 draft is going to have like 8 all stars. And top ten player potential. Like the 1996 draft. So you’re batshit crazy to say we shouldn’t trade Lowry.

      • onemanweave

        Read an interesting article a while back quoting an NBA scout giving comparisons of current NBA players to the top draft candidates.
        Wish I could find it now, but can’t. Anyway, I believe he compared Randle to Zach Randolph and other top picks to some good — very good NBA players. None of them were compared to Kobe or LeBron, Chris Paul or Derek Rose. The one I DO remember is that he compared Wiggins to Rudy Gay.
        Does that mean he’s right? Of course not, but he is a professional judge of talent, so his guess is as good as yours or mine, maybe better. Also Jim Boheim (sp?) coach of the Syracuse basketball team is quoted as saying ‘ there’s no one in this draft worth tanking for.’ Is he bomb proof? No. Is he better acquainted with college-level players than you and I? Yes.
        The commonly stated opinion that there are eight — all star to franchise talents, take your pick — may be overly optimistic. If you gut this team, Zach Randolph probably isn’t going to carry you to a title next year or the year after or the year after. And Rudy Gay DEFINITELY isn’t.
        It would be great to get a top pick. There is a chance to get a generational talent. It isn’t guaranteed.
        No argument that I may be ‘batshit crazy’.LOL but I didn’t say we shouldn’t trade Lowry. I said there are factors to consider that we aren’t aware of. Maybe we should. Maybe we shouldn’t. Let’s wait and see what MU thinks.

    • Bryan Colangelo

      I would argue that even trading Kyle Lowry wouldn’t be enough to sink this team to the six or seventh pick. There are so many teams playing absolutely terrible ball right now.

      I can understand wanting to trading Lowry, I just don’t see how you’ll get decent value in return, and even then, I don’t think it’s enough. You got to wonder, how many assets do you give up for below market-value just so you can have a chance at a pick?

  • drunkguy

    I love Tim

  • TheR3dMenace

    DeMar is a legit closer. He did everything right, he drew fouls and had massive dunks on the Knicks in the 4th. He is the real deal.

  • rtzyyz

    My observations
    1) with that ripped shirt under the jersey TH looks like a complete psychotic nut job.
    2) with the nappy hair and unshaven beard Amare looks like a washed out hobo that should be living under a bridge somewhere.
    3) I don’t think jack Armstrong watches the same games as we are. At one point half way through the third he gave casey credit for Ross’ development and how casey gave him the confidence to play through mistakes. WHAT?!?! $?#?%*@ Casey was the fool that would always yank him after one mistake for the last season and a half and gave him some nights like 4 min of play time.
    4) anyone see the close ups of bargs at he end of the game sitting on the bench? Dude looked like he was on the verge of tears. Hehe hehe
    5) speaking of bargs, if I was him I would stay out of Chandlers way cause dude looks like he is going to snap soon and go chuck Norris on someone’s ass as bargs is a primo candidate.
    6) Lastly, I had to take the bargnani blood pressure meter out of storage because when Vasquez shoots that 3 I get the same heart palpitations as when bargs use to Chuck them up. Scary stuff.

    • TheSpiceTyrant

      “jack Armstrong watches the same games as we are. At one point half way through the third he gave casey credit for Ross’ development and how casey gave him the confidence to play through mistakes. ”

      Let’s be fair:
      If you are not at practices, NOBODY on this list can truly make comments about player development. Sure TR didn’t get lotsa court time. Bu you cannot equate a players development.exclusively to this.

      • rtzyyz

        I agree. I don’t know what happens at practice. My issue was with the comment about letting him play through mistakes. Until 7 games ago it never happened. One mistake and TR found him self glued on the bench and he played scared. I’m sure at practice they work with Him a lot but playing through mistakes only happened recently instead of the hook and now we get to see a confident TR and it’s really nice.

        • TheSpiceTyrant

          The ability to “play through mistakes” is a lot tougher and not as simple as seeing what happens when you throw kids in game situations.

          Now I’m not an NBA coach, but am a coach and can say that it takes time/skill to think at game speed. It comes from maturity, practice, and mental conditioning. Successfully playing through mistakes assumes you are mature and mentally prepared when things go wrong.

          I encourage you to look at TRs body language when he misses his rotations and gets scored on.

          I’m just saying that it’s never that simple. And staying hungry is a powerful motivator.

    • Pele


      BTW, I streamed the MSG broadcast. Can’t take Jack and Matt.

      • rtzyyz

        That’s a good idea…I shall try that

    • wakez

      you don’t like Tyler’s shirt or Amare’s ‘nappy’ hair? you think Casey’s a fool for yanking Ross when he’d mess up as a rookie? maybe you should get spiffed up and go visit your old frat house and strut around giving them your observations on things. I think they’ve been saving some of those Glee episodes you’ve been wanting to watch.

      • rtzyyz

        Blah blah blah…blah blah blah
        Don’t you know how to laugh?
        It’s a joke.
        Personal insults are very…Ummm….very you.

    • arsenalist

      Don’t forget – he only ripped the shirt off of one arm. The other arm is intact. Something to do with thermodynamics and advanced stats.

      • rtzyyz


  • Do-Gooder

    Is anyone else feeling deja vu of the ’06-’07 season right bow? Does Masai aggravate this? This is the best NBA basketball I’ve seen in Toronto in many, many years…

  • GetLicks

    Was at the game sitting just above the players’ tunnel, those cheers for Bargani you heard were from some of the Knicks fans in attendance, who completely piped down after the first quarter. Also, not sure if they showed it on the broadcast, but Chandler tried to go after JV going into the tunnel after the game. My guess is that JV chirped him cause of the cheap TC took at him in the fourth. I love JV, he is everything that Bargnani was not!! I fkn love the way the kid plays, doesn’t back down from anyone & has heart every time he steps on the court… And apparently even when he walks off of it 🙂 nothing sweeter than a back2back ass-kicking of NY!

    • GetLicks

      Cheap shot**

    • Philoveritas

      I did see that incident in the tunnel on TV…At first I thought maybe JV was hanging around to smooth things over with Chandler. I couldn’t hear what was being said, but the way things went down it must have been Chandler who talked smack cause Jonas turned around towards the Knicks side but the security guys pushed him back down the tunnel. And it wasn’t just TC that was cheap shotting JV even Bargs was giving it to him in the post.

      • GetLicks

        Ohh ok. yeah I saw JV go into the tunnel and right before Chandler was out of sight, he just seemed to freak out and I saw security holding him back..just assumed it was JV he was trying to get at.

  • Justafan

    This comment from a NYK forum, notice the :outcoached part

    Can we keep Woodson on as an assistant and just hire a new head coach? At least Dolan wouldn’t be “firing” him, instead just give him the Lawrence Frank demotion and bring in somebody who isn’t going to be outcoached routinely by Dwayne Casey

    • mountio

      I assume you note the insult to Casey … in that if anyone is getting outcoached by him, they must be REALLY bad …

  • StabbyRaccoon

    I want playoffs! :D. I hear you tankers and you have some decent points, a better pick is a better pick even if it’s not a top pick. But nothing is going to be better for the development of their past picks than getting into the playoffs with a good seed and fighting it out in a competitive series.

  • Bill

    I’ll tell you… if you were sitting in section 312, there was a group of about 4 people cheering hard for Bargs. I kept turning around to give them the evil eye, don’t think that did as much to shut them up as the Knicks losing though.

  • Louvens Remy

    So Kyle Lowry is a top 10 PG in the NBA this year if u include the injuries to Rondo, Rose and Westbrook. Probably ahead of Kyrie if u want to look at metrics and not just razzle dazzle. My question is, isn’t that what teams want? A top level PG that is well rounded? So why the rush to trade him? Why not move fwd with him and trade one or more of Novak, Fields, or Hansborough to “contending” teams for assets? If he’s doing everything u want in a PG, why not build with him in mind? I would love to have Marcus Smart, but maybe, we may have enough assets to draft high on draft day by making a trade on draft day to add to this team by trading some of our “specialists”. GO RAPZ

    • mountio

      The short answer is yes, IF you think all these things are true (and will continue to be true), then ya, I would sign him. I would agree hes a top 15 PG (playing like a top 10 these last few games) – but lets not forget that you can certainly get better – the 3 you mentioned + parker, llillard, wall, CP3, Conley, curry, lawson, bledsoe to name a few .. its a stacked position.
      But, lets concede hes a top 15 guy. So, the next question is what do you have to pay him. The open market will be $10m/year ish if I had to guess. Is that fair? Who knows, but some team will pay it. So, can / should the raps have two guys (DD/KL signed at $10 mm / year ish), where both guys are top half type guys, but not top 5 type guys. Im not sure.
      Id much rather have a young guy play PG who isnt as good as as Lowry, but isnt miles behind and leave that money for JV if he develops, draft pick if they develop, TR if he develops, a free agent, etc – whoever we have that is legitimately an all star type. I think we are better to pay an all star $12-$15 mm / year than KL $10 mm.
      Finally, you have the inconsistency factor. KL has had trouble with coaches in the past (including DC) and came in out of shape last year … do you want to take the chance on a guy with this type of history? Hes playing great now, but would you bet your life on the next 4 years? I wouldn’t (whereas I would with Lillard, for example).
      Throw in that his trade value is at an all time high .. and as tough as it would be .. Id trade him if a first rounder is on offer in return …

      • ckh26

        This year there is apparently a half dozen quality PG’s in the 2014 draft supposedly coming out. That combined with not that many teams needing PG’s might be a reason to take a managed risk and trading Kyle for an uber high return of a 1st and a rotation player that upgrades on our current 9 man rotation.

        But its still a risk as these guys are still prospects where Kyle has shown he can do it.

        Whose coming out…According to the CBS guys: Dante Exum from Australia,
        Marcus Smart of Oklahoma State, Jahii Carson of Arizona State, Andrew
        Harrison of Kentucky,,Semaj Christon of Xavier, Russ Smith of Louisville and I will add the kid from Syracuse Tyler Ennis. Not all 7 are going to be gone before we pick …

  • AnthonyF

    And exactly where is Lowry going as a free agent? Does he have no interest playing with a competitive team like Toronto? I understand trading him if we plan on the lottery, which is no easy prospect, but conversely we can sign him too and be competitive going forward.

  • ckh26

    Aside from kicking Gotham ass hard with a hob nailed boot and taking their lunch money in a back to back…..I have to love JV’s standing up to Tyson Chandler. Chirp for Chirp and he didn’t back away from this guy as he did it. Stood right there. Kyle stepped in and showed JV he is there for him. Not that Kyle would do much against Chandler but the fact he showed up during a potential scrap speaks volumes about whose running the team right now.

    Hope this lasts right into May.

  • DDD

    that cheering for bargs you heard was from a cluster of rowdy knicks fans in one 300 section that i was unfortunately close to. but when the raps were up by 20 they shut up.
    also DON’T trade lowry! i love his game and work ethic so much!

  • Louvens Remy

    We should trade Lowry for Derrick Rose…oh wait. He’s injury prone too. Damn.