Coming up on the All-Star break, it’s a short one where the following is discussed:

  1. Terrence Ross in the dunk comp as a dark horse, we talk about the favorite, Ross’ chances, and the general sentiment towards the dunk contest
  2. Is Rudy Gay the best pure talent Colangelo has ever acquired? Strong case for the affirmative
  3. OKC model comment mentioned in Rapcast
  4. Colangelo…luv
  5. The fans are back on Colangelo’s side, as witnessed by the recent poll where 64% suggested bringing him back next year. What are the two reasons this is the case? Gay is #1, but #2 is…
  6. Revisiting how Bosh walked out and equating it to how OKC handled the same situation with Harden.
  7. Amir Johnson’s foul rate, at-the-rim and short-range finishing percentages, defensive improvement and strength
  8. Looking back at Amir’s extension – is there an apology due to Colangelo, or did he jump the gun on Amir?
  9. Setting a win total based on previous East 8th seed totals, setting a target post-All Star record, and seeing what the Raptors have to do to get there

Grab the iTunes feed or the plain old feed. You can also download the file (25:30, 9MB). Or just listen below:

http://soundcloud.com/raptorsrepublic/rapcast-133-colangelo-forgiven

  • voy

    I dont dislike or like BC but how in the world does anyone forget the Bosh walk?  Clearly his biggest blunder and one that I would be inclined not to forgive.

    However, the drafting of bargs in the draft is not as an inexcusable mistake, in my mind. This is not an excuse for Andrea not fulfilling his potential but there is only one other guy that could have gone number #1 in the draft.  The choice between Andrea and LaMarcus was definately not a clear cut choice and in fact I think you can make the argument that Andrea has/had a larger skillset than Aldridge.  Obviously this skillset, perhaps because of work ethic, perhaps because of toughness, or perhaps because of other reasons has not translated to better on court performance.  Either way, I dont think you can say “ohhh, we could have been so much better if we drafted anyone else but andrea with the #1 spot.  there is no way andrea should have been our #1 pick”.   in my mind, this is a tough argument to make, especially if you readily admit, like it sounds you have, that no one would have taken gay as their number 1 pick.

    Lets not forget the guys that were drafted right after ab and la.  we had adam morrison, tyrus thomas, sheldon williams (I think even morrison and thomas were considered by scouts and publications in the discussion for the #1 pick overall.

    • cdub

      Regarding the Bosh walk, what exactly was BC to get for him?  He would have to agree to an extension with the team he was to be traded to in all likelyhood, which he would not have.  So now we are talking about BC trading Bosh as an expring deal to some other team he wasn’t going to resign with anyway.  Just curious as to what everyone thinks BC would have actually got for Bosh in that situation?  OKC traded Harden to the team he was signing his extension with. 

      • Nilanka15

        I don’t have any sources, but weren’t there rumoured offers from Houston and Chicago? 

        If the rumours were true, it sounded like the Rockets and Bulls we willing to risk Bosh leaving at season’s end.

        But whatever the offers might’ve been, I’m sure they were better than a pick and a trade exception (which partially netted us Bayless and James Johnson….if memory serves correctly).

        • DumbassKicker

          Assuming the rumours about Houston’s and Chicago’s interest were accurate, both being quite believable, none of us has a clue what offers, or stipulations, were discussed. I don’t know about relying upon rumours and speculation telling us that the Bulls and Rockets were prepared to risk him walking, but if they were, the question is do you really think they were willing to give much up to take that risk? You certainly can’t assume so.

          I seriously doubt it, as neither of those teams strike me as giving up value for a 2 month rental, when not a contender that needs that one piece for a championship. In any case, how can “whatever the offers might’ve been, I’m sure they were better than a pick……”? That was 2 picks, 1 of them being our own pick coming back, that netted us Jonas. You can argue about the wisdom of having given up that pick to begin with, but that’s an independent discussion. Speaking specifically of the Bosh handling, we got what turned out to be a 5th pick, though we had the 3rd worst record (good old Raptors “luck” that some wish to rely upon for years to come), that turned into Jonas. How can you say you’re “sure” we could have done better with the Bulls or Rockets?

          This year is a good example, of teams stuck in a bind just like the Raps. Atlanta may be seeing Josh Smith walk, Utah may be seeing Millsap and/or Jefferson walk. I’ve no doubt that there are at least several teams who would like those guys, but let’s see if anybody offers much for those guys, without an extension.

        • cdub

          I don’t recall the rumours. but I agree if there was a deal that made sense he passed up on people should be critical.  I just haven’t read anything that indicated he did so with certainty.  I’m interested to know though.  Who knows, maybe there were better deals, maybe there weren’t, maybe they were an even split and he decided to roll the dice on Bosh.

  • skeptical

    I remember people being upset on draft day that we didn’t grab Tyrus Thomas. Bargs is far from the best player in the draft, but he’s also not the complete bust that some people seem to think.  Now the high priced extension?  Classic BC overpay.  But I don’t fault the draft pick.

    All season I’ve been wondering where the Amir haters have been. Guy still isn’t the best at his position, but he’s solid. Working hard, fouling less (I have no stats for this – it’s just my impression) to stay on the court, and really has been the anchor of the Raptors D for much of the season. The contract that many laughed at doesn’t seem like such a stretch now, and certainly not the worst on this team.

    This doesn’t mean that BC made the right choice when signing the contract – take enough gambles and one is sure to pay off eventually, plus the consistent habit of overpaying is going to have some real consequences soon. Fields isn’t living up to his pay, Bargs isn’t coming close, Gay (even if best player on the team and one of BC’s best moves IMO) has a massive contract, and DeRozan still has consistency issues.

    Not sure how a few meaningless wins can make fans forget that BC has generally failed to put together a winning squad, has run through far too many coaches, and has left the franchise with a huge payroll despite the lack of in-game results. I wouldn’t sign an extension… but then again, who really wants the job as his replacement? Hands might be tied in that regard.

    • Nilanka15

      Attached is a good summary of many of the 2006 mock drafts.  Of the 13 listed, 5 had Bargnani as the top pick, 6 had Aldridge, 1 had Thomas, and 1 had Morrison. 

      Gay’s name didn’t appear until the 3rd pick.

      http://www.nba.com/bobcats/draft_mocks_060601.html

      • Nilanka15

        Ooops, I meant to reply to voy’s 1st post above.

      • cesco

         AOL.com had Thomas , Aldridge , Bargnani , Roy , RONDO in that order . The  only ones on that list to pick Rondo in the top five , the only one to pick   Thomas # 1.

  • voy

    secondly, the comment that was referenced has a lot of points up for debate, in my opinion.  I’ll just touch upon the first one I came across.

    equating going with a youth movement and building through the draft is not the same thing as telling your young players  “you are not good enough” and is not the same thing as telling your young players “dont try to win”.  who would ever tell young players “dont try to win”?

    by rebuilding through the draft, or sticking to a youth movement you try and win.  however, you try and win by playing the young guys.  and you are telling the young guys you think they are good enough by giving them minutes on the floor, by allowing them to work through their mistakes, by allowing them to learn how to win and by coaching them. 

    having a longer term vision, is not the same thing as saying I want to lose today.  hey, if you dont have to lose today, you dont.  but at some point you have to accept reality.  if your team is stacked with avg vets no one else wants you have to say to yourself, “hey, I can try and squeek out a max of 30 wins by playing the alan andersons of the nba or I can let the young guys play and potentially accelerate their development.  Winning 35 games with the alan andersons of the world vs the alternative of winning 20 games with young players is not winning.  

    I’m not saying the player you draft between the #1 spot and the #5 spot is guaranteed to be better than the player someone else drafts between the 6th spot and the 13th spot.  But I am saying your chances are better.  And I’m not saying the guy you get at number 1 is going to be lebron but I am saying you are not going to win the championship with a john lucas.

    In the end, I think my point is if you are good enough to compete for the title you obviously compete for the title.  but by the same token, winning 35 games with aging vets vs the alternative of rebuilding through the draft and wining 20 games with young kids should not be considered winning.

    • Nilanka15

      Great post.

    • DumbassKicker

      I drew a bigger picture, yet you choose to comment on one corner of it, with what in my opinion, are the on-going simplistic views held by many. Though I feel the views are too simplistic for the real world of NBA drafting and player development, life’s in the way of responding appropriately to this right now, but I’ll get back, some time over the weekend, with something less than the essay it might take for some to grasp.

    • DumbassKicker

      The simple and over-riding response I have for this commonly (here at RR anyway) held attitude, is that managing an NBA team, drafting players, and developing players, isn’t a paint by numbers task that one can just say “well, just follow Sam Presti’s model”, the popular flavour of the day, or the model of player “x” development.

      Though you also touched on tanking for a high position in the draft, going beyond “just touch upon the first one I came across” in the form of letting players play through their mistakes vs winning atmosphere, that’s one example of how managing and coaching a NBA is more complex than simply following some constant script.

      No two players are the same in terms of their maturity and ability to
      not have their confidence destroyed through “playing through mistakes”,
      and no two teams have the same group of players that will respond the
      same way. Unlike us fans, qualified NBA coaches work with and see a
      given player’s development every day on the practice court, as his
      teammates do. Some players have both a skill set for their position, and
      a mindset that you can throw them into the fire right away, some don’t.
      I would suggest that the coaches, and supporting cast, are in far
      better position to judge that.

      As examples from the favourite flavour
      (OKC), KD and Westbrook played big minutes from the start, but Harden’s
      first year average MPG was very close to JV’s and Ibaka’s first year MPG very close to
      Ross’s. Do you think OKC stunted the growth of those two, or suddenly
      got stupid? They saw the circumstances of their team, and the required development steps differently for each individual player. Dissing BC/Casey for not letting Ross get chewed to pieces over and over for extended minutes, is naively thinking all rookies are at the same stage of development, and their psyche is made the same.

      As far as building from youth through the draft, what the hell do you think the raptors have been doing the past few years? DD, ED (converted to 26 yr old Gay), Jonas, Ross, a probable weak draft pick converted to 26 yr old Lowry. How many more years do you think the Raptors should target the luck of a lottery, for crap shoot high draft picks, before they get the most of the youth they have?

      At the end of the day, using inarguable, but simplistic (imo), views such as:

      “I’m not saying the player you draft between the #1 spot and the #5 spot
      is guaranteed to be better than the player someone else drafts between
      the 6th spot and the 13th spot.  But I am saying your chances are
      better.  And I’m not saying the guy you get at number 1 is going to be
      lebron but I am saying you are not going to win the championship with a
      john lucas.”

      is hardly qualifying anybody to judge what a GM/Coach are doing with the circumstances and players they have to deal with.

  • Andre

    I believe BC has out stayed his welcome. I agree Rudy Gay was a good move, but I dont think that was him. I think that was pressure from the bosses. I am a firm believer that he has made some extremely questionable moves and ANY other GM would have been fired by now. The Amir Johnson signing, very stupid, who negoiates like that? Was DeRozen the same? I would have waited with DeRozen. He gets that kind of money and hasnt showed anything. The Raptors are playing well right now, 17-12 is Doable , but I believe the bucks and the celtics will continue to win. The Raptors NEED to be .500 to make the playoffs. If the raptors dont make the playoffs, BC should be FIRED. Regardless of how he “turned it around” this year. 

  • Andre

    The OKC model works. Its worked for other teams. Sacramento is the only one it didnt really pan out for. I still believe they need to trade assets to get a vetern pressence in there. If the raptors  took this route in the next couple of years, they would have an Andre Bennett (or Noel Nerlens) and then an Andrew wiggens. Im sorry, but those players including VC and Ross seems WAY more promising.

    • Dan

       The OKC model worked for them but it doesn’t always work. You have an example of it not working in the exact same draft. Portland took Oden instead and it failed miserably. The year the Raptors won the draft there was no set #1. Rondo and Roy are arguably the best playesr from that draft and even then would Rondo have the same success if it were not for the veterans he has played with. Roy had some great years but is already pretty much done due to his knees. Spurs had a terrible year with injuries and won the Tim duncan draft when they already had a good team and Boston got screwed because they actually were a terrible team and it took them years to recover. It’s a draft you don’t get a guarantee to get the spot you should get. The worst team rarely gets the top pick. If Portland chose Durant first the OKC model may not be one your even talking about or striving to be. Without it’s a different team. With Oden injured maybe they take a big instead of Westbrook the next year then they don’t take a chance on a big like ibaka later in the draft. Even without durant that is still a playoff team but not a contender.
      Bulls were in the playoffs already weren’t they and it was a pick from a trade that went like 5 or 6 spots higher when they got Rose. You just never know what will happen or how a player will translate to the nba. What about Washington with Kwame Brown. How many horrible seasons have the bobcats had and still have no real franchise guy.

      • Dan

         The year Rose went it could have just have easily been Beasily who went one because he was putting up Durant and Carmelo stats in college. 

  • Theswirsky

    The people who call what OKC did luck are those who don’t understand the genius of Sam Presti.  Its the NBA equivalent of individuals who call Warren Buffet lucky. 

    Start doing some research on the guy.  Once people understand the ability, intelligence, the planning, the focus, the attention to detail and the desire that guy has…. only a fool would call what he’s done lucky.  

    There is a difference between planning and taking a calculated risk and the magic 8 ball GM’s like Colangelo use. 

    • Nilanka15

      I guess the “lucky” part comes from landing the 2nd pick, in a year where Oden was the consensus number 1.  Without Durant, OKC isn’t a title contender, regardless of the following smart moves by Presti.

      But then again, this kind of “luck” is required by every contender, San Antonio with Duncan, and Chicago with Rose as examples.  You can’t build a winner without a combination of luck AND smart moves.

      • Theswirsky

        I’ll further that.  Is Miami any less lucky to have had Wade become chummy with Lebron and Bosh at the Olympics?   Are the Lakers any less lucky for Kobe not wanting to be in Charlotte while simultaneously having a sap GM in Charlotte?  Was Detroit any less lucky when Orlando willing threw a wade of cash at Grant Hill and to make that work needed to include players (Ben Wallace) in a sign and trade?  Was Dallas any less lucky that the Bobcats wanted to dump Chandler’s contract?

        So at what point does skill, planning, and risk management trump luck? 

        “Without Durant, OKC isn’t a title contender”

        lets say Presti doesn’t draft Durant in 07.  Who does he draft instead?  Who does he then draft the following year instead and teh year after?  What other moves does he make instead?  Does everything else stay exactly the same?

        Given what Presti has accomplished over the years, with moves other than Durant,  I don’t think its difficult to think that if Presti doesn’t draft Durant he still builds a contender.  Just with a different roster than he currently as.
         

        • voy

          I think there is a measure of luck that can not entirely be discounted.  however, the list of teams in that link that have sucked for an extended period of time have something else in common other than trying to build through the draft – their management has been horrible. 

          its not like if those teams decided to build through FA and trades, team xyz would automatically start making excellent player transactions and turn itself into an elite team.  if your management is poor, your management is poor.  your team is not going to accidentally become elite regardless of how they try and build it.

          • Guest

             Management is poor, also poor ownership.  it starts from the top.  Minny, Sac, Clippers (til recently) come to mind.

        • wes mantooth

          durant is everything in this situation. hes 1a or 1b best player in the league. i think presti best move was westbrook. people scoffed at that. harden was the obvious choice. in terms of ibaka, ithink when youre playing for a great team with a great leader it has to speed up development. 
          actually i”ll agree with the rapcast! his best move was the handling of harden. 

          • Dan

             I agree with the development of Ibaka as the Spurs have shown if you know what you need and stick to a system you can develop players nobody else noticed. Westbrook is shooting 32% frm 3 42% from the field and averages about 3.6% percent from the field. If he didn’t play with Durant on a team with the record they have now we would look at him in the same light as some people see Gay. More of a volume shooter. As he gets older and less athletic he will be less effective.

        • morons

          if he doesn’t draft durant then he drafts horford. and seeing as there have been no KD-type players in the draft since 07, then his team would be fucked and atl-hawks mediocre. there is only one durant in this league dumbass, he is a once in a decade type of player. there is a lot of luck involved but you think it was presti’s magical skill that allowed him to draft right after portland drafted the consensus 1. stfu

          • Dan

             I would be shocked if anyone other then Oden goes number one. It was a wrist injury he had in college nothing to do with the injuries that have so far ruined his career. None of the gms can see the future Horford is not getting picked ahead of Oden. Today yes back then no way.

            • Dan

               I mean number two if Durant was taken number one.

            • morons

              oh ya I agree, oden was for sure going number 1 no matter what, and durant was number two. I was just talking about a hypothetical scenario if OKC had to draft #3 or later. the point I’m making is if they never drafted Durant then they’d never find a player like him in the drafts since, and this still hold true yet theswirsky moron over there thinks presti still couldve built a contender like the 2012 western conference finals winners of today. 

              • Theswirsky

                actually theswirsky moron said Presti still would have built a contender but it would be UNLIKE the western conference finals winners of today.

                but I will say its alot easier to argue a strawman.

                • morons

                  it would be unlike the present-day thunder? lmao. says the guy who is all about championship or bust when it comes to the Raps, but when it comes to Presti, anything less than an NBA finals appearance would be a huge achievement? so which side are you on pal? I need your strawman bullshit theory to explain this one plz.

                • truth be told

                  You have NO idea what personnel moves would have been made or how that team would be comprised without Durant.

                  Keep quiet man.

          • truth be told

            You don’t know what would have happened or who he would have took.

            Keep quiet man.

        • Dan

           He is an excellent gm. If Durant goes 1 Oden is going number 2 and yes that will change all his other moves but what it wouldn’t change is no other player drafted since durant has managed to be on his level yet. Next to lebron Durant is a pretty clear choice for next best player in the NBA.To say you can take away Durant and still replicate that success is pretty bold. Because unless you manage to Pry Lebron away from Miami or the cavs you will not match the talent level you have now. The players he has chosen since may not be the palyers they are without playing with Durant. You take him away and have a headcase like Westbrook as your lead guy and your looking at a Sacramento type situation.  As good as he is you could make an argument he bet on the wrong guy and should have chose Harden as his number two over Westbrook.  As westbrooks athletics fade I see him more of baron davis or steve francis type player who gets by more on athletics then IQ. Harden is has really high basketball IQ and less off court distractions.

          • Dan

             I do agree with you Presti would still put together a good team. Had he been running the Cavs Lebron may still be there and will have had a few more rings too. He did get incredibly lucky that Durant is the player he is because there have been more #1s not work out then there have been ones who have. Look up sam bowie when you get a chance. Go ask Bryan Colangelo how much he loves Steve Nash for making him look like a much better GM then he is. Sometimes it’s the player who is more responsible for the success then the GM. The fact Durant came in a year when there was even a debate as to weather he should be one or two is one of the luckiest things that has ever happened to presti. There were two that year and on a 50 50 chance he had the better option fall in his lap. Had the tables been switched he may have chose Oden himself despite what he has said since.

          • wes mantooth

            i agree that in the long run harden might be the better bet , but for right now he’s still freakishly athletic and this is there time to compete. by the time he loses it who knows?? you can better prep for harden kd then westbrook kd in my opinion..although hardens passing and handles continue to impress.. my point is that i have no point i guess

      • Guest

        Seattle didn’t land the 2nd pick that year because of ping pong balls. The Celtics were terrible that year (remember?), and they were the ones who received the pick. Presti then got their pick by flipping Ray Allen over to them for it, because he had it in his mind to retrieve Durant not Oden. That to me is evidence of an empirical nature that Presti didn’t luck into KD. He made it happen.  

        • 1234

          the Boston pick that went to Seattle was number 5

          • morons

            where they picked jeff green over noah…skill.

            • Dan

               presti is a good GM but Durant turning out to be the player he is is what helps make Presti look like the GM he is. Noah is better then Green but if you take Noah you don’t trade for perkins and may not pick Ibaka. It’s been just as much luck as it has been skill. He also drafted cole aldrich so he is doesn’t have the golden touch everytime like theswirsky thinks. You could make the argument the Perkins trade may have helped them get through the west but is a player who hurts them against miami. Last night they made a run once they went small with him on the becnch. He is two unskilled on the offensive end to make miami pay for not having a big man.

              • Theswirsky

                “He also drafted cole aldrich so he is doesn’t have the golden touch EVERYTIME like theswirsky thinks”

                whoops theres one of those strawmen again.

                anyways, you should perhaps do your research on WHY Presti drafted Aldrich (hint: Presti had his team already assembled but he wanted insurance with his bigs and a valuable asset, which Cs tend to be.) Thats the difference between Presti’s and guys like yourself – he has foresight and planning.  Aldrich turned out to be part of the Harden deal which helped not only save money, maintain a quality team, but add youth and draft picks for the future.

                Turns out he did have the golden touch, even when it came to Cole Aldrich.

                • cdashq

                  after readying all these posts its quite clear that Theswirsky is a pretty huge supporter of Sam Presit and his ability to build a basketball team. I am too, so glad to see we are on the same page.
                  That being said, as it is with players, coaches, and people in all walks of life, there are those that excel at their job, those that are good at their job, those that are mediocre at their job and those that are shit at their job. its obvious that Sam Presti (schooled in SA) excels at his job. 

                  But how many Sam Presti’s are there out there? My thought is very, very, very few. The fact is, all 30 GMs that run NBA teams are more knowledgable about how to build a basketball team than you or I, and all those GMs know that for all the foresight, and planning and scouting and evaluating, it still does take little luck for championships contending teams to form.

                  For whatever reason, we have not had that luck. But should BC be blamed? I say he obviously holds a level of responsibility for his moves, but for a GM that hasn’t had the ‘luck’ that some others have had, he still has shown is willingness to make quick changes when his moves don’t pan out the way they should. I give him a lot more credit for that than many on these boards seem to.

                  Imagine Bargnani had become every bit the franchise player his draft position suggested he should be. We would likely view BC in a completely different light? Imagine when he traded for JO, he never got hurt and him and Bosh formed the twin tower team he had envisioned? Imagine if Turk, fresh off his trip to the finals, filled the SF void at such a level that he helped carry the Raptors into the playoffs just like he helped Dwight’s Magic get there? These were all moves that he made with the expectation that they would provide what was needed to form a winning team, and for reasons on the court itself, they didn’t/haven’t panned out. But with all those moves (except Bargnani) BC has made immediate efforts to make changes. 

                  Again, keeping in mind that the league and players still viewed Toronto as a franchise that is not as desirable because they are not a winning franchise and on top of that, we happen to be in a different country (as much as we hate to admit it, the reality is that that does play a fact in FA decisions).

                  So with all that being said, I am really just trying to make the point that just because one or two GMs succeed in creating a plan and also get blessed with the luck that allows the plan to take shape, doesn’t mean that all GMs can have this happen. Most of them have to do exactly what BC has done which is make a move, take a risk, take an educated gamble, and then attempt to correct it when it does not work out. 

                  I still am certain that BC garners enough respect around the league that he can get other GMs attention in a way a “Rob Babcock” level GM could not. As difficult as it is to see when we look at our team, that has been a marginal playoff team during the best years of his tenure, BC is still an asset to the Toronto Raptors organization and if he gets a little luck to go along with his moves, we will be better for it.

                  The Rudy Gay trade was great proof that he is still trying, though most seem to want to say “he’s trying to save his job” and “he’s reaching to get to the playoffs”. Well if you were him, wouldn’t you try to save your job too? Especially if it is by making a move that adds more talent to the team than has been there since his entire tenure. 

                  I am one that trusts in Colangelo. Not because i’m a blind supporter, but because I clearly remember what it was like to have a bonehead GM who did not know how to run a team and didn’t have the respect around the league to get things done. He clearly has the best interest of the team at heart, but I suppose, unless we start actually competing in the playoffs, Raptor fans will continue to question his ability to build a team, as if its just that easy and things would fall into place that much better with someone else. And as if there is another Sam Presti just waiting for BC to get fired so he can jump in and save the Raptors. 

                • truth be told

                  I got news for you. We do have a bonehead GM who does not know how to run a team.

        • Dan

           That was the 5th pick that was Green.

  • 511

    TRoss is getting lots of attention tying the Dunk Cancer campaign to #RossShallDunk. Well done, so far. 

    It’ll be nice if he nails a couple or so dunks … and knowing the way these things go, with the campaign that’s rolling (check out his twitter), if he DOES nail his dunks, the contest might be his for the taking. Which would be quite alright. 

    In the meantime, what might be most helpful to TRoss and his career as a Raptor is him being around all the high-level talent that he’ll be mingling with over the weekend. That kind of experience can raise a young player’s sights and (by extension) his game. If he rejoins his team after the weekend with stars in his eyes, wanting to strive harder to be one of those guys, a bona fide All Star, the weekend will have been a BIG success. Fingers crossed. 

  • j bean

    The new lineup that BC has put together now is what I would judge whether or not he should be forgiven and resigned. Are you going to say  “I didn’t like the teams he put together in the past”  and give him the boot for that? Not if this team goes on a Cinderella run into the playoffs. On the other hand if this team can’t maintain their winning ways since the trade and end up not showing a significant improvement over last years winning % then he should get a thumbs down. I put 35 wins as the magic #. That means going .500 the rest of the way. If they can do that, next season will hold the legitimate promise of a 45 win team with real opportunities to make some noise around the league.

  • http://www.facebook.com/chris.read.37 Chris Read
  • Andrew D

    Anyone who thinks that model (OKC) works all the time needs to check themselves. Weak drafts, players not hitting potential, developing slow then leaving for a bigger market are all possible. OKC should have had Oden (you see how that would work) Westbrook was never a lock to be this good (suprisingly people questioned his athleticism and shooting consistency) Harden was a good pick, smart, biggest question was weight but he came to combine is great shape.
    It works some of the time.

    SAC-did not work Twolves-did not work (been to the lottery coutless times) CHA-We will see but so far their picks leave alot to be desired.

    Have to make  decision either way to rebuild or use some sort of draft trade sign combo. While his decisions on Fields Bargs have been questionable I have no issue with the picks, JV was genius and Ross is TBD. He’s aggressive and I like that.

    • Dan

       Add washrington both Wall and Kwame and the Raptors (Andrea) to the list.. Washington only now has a chance to improve because they traded away all the high picks for proven veterans to surround wall. Luck has so much to do with it.  Spurs are the ones taking 2nd rounders and making them good rotation players year after year.  Tim Duncan is in his late 30’s and they have not had a top pick in years and yet still have the best record in the NBA and Manu and Parker were not lottery picks. People should be talking about the spurs model before talking about the okc.

  • Darien

    Usually when we’re talking about evaluation, it’s the subject’s more recent, most consistent work. BC might have just saved his job with the RG trade, but it isn’t like we pulled a massive heist on Memphis. What BC is known for is bringing in old, used up veterans, overpaying marginal players, dumpster-diving in the D-league, and holding on to players that should have been moved long ago. Now that everyone in the league has wised up to our 10 million dollar wet noodle, we are stuck with him and that is 100% on BC. Therefore, even with the RG trade, we need to let BC work his magic on a different team, and bring in a GM who will move us past treadmill mediocrity.

    • Dan

      rudy only being 26 or 27 makes it a little better compared to Hedo and Oneal already being on the decline.

  • monocled_gentleman_scholar

    Nice rapcast. One thing that wasn’t mentioned that I wonder about: has the ball movement and player movement declined a bit since the Gay acquisition? I feel like at times guys are content to just feed Gay the ball and wait for him to go to work.

  • Smithey

    We got our 2011 First Round Pick (Valanciunas) back from the Bosh Sign and Trade.

    • Paul

       Ya. I never understood that move on Miami’s part. That Toronto first rounder was so valuable and Pat Riley gave it back to us when it seems he could have just signed Bosh outright (we took no salary back from Miami). Was the extra year on Bosh’s contract that valuable to Miami, or would Bosh actually have refused to sign with Miami for less than he got from Colangelo in the sign and trade?
      Odd.

      • Theswirsky

        Miami never gave Toronto back the pick that led to Val.  They gave Toronto back a lottery protected pick.

        • The Truth

          Miami gave Toronto two picks in that deal, one was the pick that was originally Toronto’s. That pick was not protected in the deal and was used to draft Jonas. The other pick was Miami’s and was protected in the deal, but it was used to obtain James Johnson.

          • Theswirsky

            thats actually backwards.  Toronto’s pick that was returned to them was the protected pick.  Its why Toronto was able to draft Demar Derozan and Ed Davis the 2 years following after the Marion deal. (it was lottery protected for 5 years, and each year Toronto kept the pick Miami received Toronto’s 2nd rounder instead)  Since Toronto did not make the playoffs they would have been able to draft Val regardless of Bosh sign and trade. 

  • hater

    RD is a Talent? Muhahaha bis % is so bad, this is the guy you were waiting for?? Oh .. my .. God..